Opinion
Don’t get your hopes up
Moshe Elad
Published: 07.08.10, 13:05
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
47 Talkbacks for this article
1. Well Said
Yaron ,   USA   (08.07.10)
2. He is correct but
Jack ,   Virginia   (08.07.10)
but look at Barak, Peled, etc. When they visit Washongton they always ask; if I push these bad Jews in gov't how much I get for my family. People in Washing ton are not that stupid. When they supercorrupt Jews like Barak they compare them with Arafat and think: these two are both corrupt.
3. The height of insanity is the propensity ....
Adina Kutnicki ,   Israel   (08.07.10)
to do the same thing over and over, yet expect a different result. And herein lies the Israeli leadership's psychosis, the result of Oslo's delusions of a besieged people. While Israel's fantasists ignore PA/Fatah increasing incitement, year in and year out;while their leaders extol terrorists as the role model for their citizens;while they roam the world demonizing, non legitimizing, and holding Israel to a double, an impossible standard, what do our leaders do? They intone the same failed 'peace' mantra, again, again, again...... Color me crazy, but isn't that the height of insanity, with a dash of hubris mixed in?
4. Everyone has known this for years.
Terry ,   Eilat - Israel   (08.07.10)
Only idiot politicians & equally idiot journalists haven't noticed.
5. Colonel (res.) Moshe Elad,
Salma ,   Palestine   (08.07.10)
Be honest with yourself and answer the following Q. : have you desire or ability to finalize agreement with PLO?!!!!!!!!!!!
6. Dominant minority time bomb
Steve Benassi ,   Silver Bay, MN USA   (08.07.10)
Moshe Elad thinks the Arabs should accept the crumbs Israel is offering. But he knows the crumbs are not enough to make real "peace". So the status quo "quiet" for the Jews is good enough for now. But the CIA reports Israel will fall in 20 years. This is because there are so few Jews compared to Arabs that minority rule of the region cannot last forever. The Jews have suffered the loss of their dominant minority status in the past, in ancient Egypt, in ancient Palestine, and in WWII Europe.
7. learned of History!
Lengualima ,   USAGBFE   (08.07.10)
The democrats leadership do not learn of history, They have forgotten of the Iran's Shah. who fallen when the western countries removed his support, And goverment of Iran became western's foe. USA did not recalls how paid those stupidity. the radical muslims of Iran, today brothers of Hizbollah kidnapped 54 USA citizens, as a payment for his colaboration to fallen the Shah, and the desastrous rescue operations from Carter's goverment. Carter was a naive politics who thought that world could be lead by good will. But the Obama politics is not naivety, are his convictions, He is the future savior of the of the Arabs of Gaza and Samaria and Judea, to the price of the destruccion of Israel. NATION WHO DO NOT RECALLED HIS HISTORY IS CONDEMNED TO REPEAT IT!
8. a gang of thieves , bullies ,and opportunists
Yousuf Shawamreh ,   Hebron , Palestine   (08.07.10)
Palestinians are drawing immense benefits from the transitional status of “being less than a state” – which explains why they fell in love with the 'pease process' This is main factat this article
9. #5, Salma: A wise old lawyer once taught me
Allan ,   Delray Beach, Fl.   (08.07.10)
that in a successful settlement the sides walk away a little unhappy. In other words, neither sides gets everything they want. As long as the Palestinians insist on unrealistic preconditions prior to direct negotiations, ie: right of return, freeze to legitimate construction within Israeli territory, the ceding of Jerusalem, etc. the negotiations are doomed to failure. Although the above mentioned are legitimate positions they ought to be negotiated within the scope of the face to face. To answer your question, Yes. Israel is willing and able to finalize a deal with the Palestinians and has proven so in the past. You will do better to focus your ire and sarcasm on your leaders. They are the ones that always change the rules of the game midway once a set of rules has been agreed upon and the game has started.
10. "Peace process" is Thanksgiving dinner. Israel is the turkey
Chaim ,   Israel   (08.07.10)
The spirit behind this, and many other articles, is that Israel is willing to give anything if only some terrorist leader would sign their name to a piece of paper. Ludicrous. Nobody has ever been able to answer the simplest question of all about the "peace process". Israel has _____ to gain by talking to the P.A. What does Israel have to lose? Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria, defensible borders, freedom from constant rocket attacks, freedom from inundation by hostile Arabs... In short, EVERYTHING. The "peace process" is Thanksgiving dinner. Israel is the turkey.
11. #to 5 I disagree with yu Salma
yousuf ,   Hebron ,Palestine   (08.07.10)
This time i disagree with yu Salma , becuase the the colonel(res.) is not in the government , and even the broad minded Israeli leaders are a way from the decision making policy . they are now influenced by desires and interests and corruption too
12. SOS
M. Hartley ,   Atlanta, US   (08.07.10)
We'll see and hear the same BS from both sides 5 years from now. I think, the two sides are performing a dance only the immediate participants understand. They've become so adept at it over the years, they don't miss a step, regardless of who plays what kind of music. It seems to be an accepted fact that neither side can ever make enough concessions to satisfy the other, and so they'll keep dancing and feeding each others' addictions until one collapses from sheer exhaustion; whether financial, emotional or both. What a waste!
13. to 5 salma
sahar ,   jerusalem   (08.07.10)
you said in other aspect in ynet .. our hope is on our children.. it means no hope of palastinian authority and eldad said the same but it is not and it will never be that in israil ...no need to any quistion .. salma ..sometimes i9 feel you are not stable in your openion as it is one pakage ...
14. palestinians
avi ,   haifa   (08.07.10)
that's what I expected. after all the pressure applied on israel by the US and the "well willing" people of europe : no direct talks. even though the arab leaque allows it. sure .eveyside has it's red line but the talks should have been without preconditions. another example of wasted time and energy .
15. Selma is a typical racist
Rina ,   Tel Aviv   (08.07.10)
This Land belong to Jews. Arabs are not stupid. They know it. That is why they destroy all Jewish. That is why Arafat/Abas/Hamas says that Temple Mount is some kind of Arabic place. They know well it belongs to Jews. If The Temple belongs to Jews then Jerusalem, Hebron, Haifa, Tel Aviv also belong to Jews. If Temple is some king of Arabic place then these cities are also Arabic - you may call it Southern Syria, Small piece of Arabia, or by any other name. That is why when Jews talk about the Temple Mount it like putting a knife into any Muslim Arab.
16. You misinterpret the author, Chaim,
Robert Haymond ,   Israel/Canada   (08.07.10)
and I've noted that misinterpretation of passages is a habit of yours. This comes about not as a result of lack of intelligence but rather from a crystallized mindset which obfuscates rather than clarifies. Loss of credibility is the price you pay.
17. Robert!
flyingdoc57 ,   Florida, U.S.A.   (08.07.10)
Have you nothing better to do than police these posts and jump down the throat of anyone who make a tiny mistake? Give it up will you, we are tired of your constant nitpicking. Can you not find something better to so with your time like pulling up the Jew haters that post here?
18. There is another wrinkle in this story
Marcella   (08.07.10)
First of all, it's easy to put the blame on the Arabs. Or foreign governments. Everyone will agree with you. But the greatest threat to Israel has been and continues to be an Israeli elite and political leadership that do not represent the best interests of the country. EVERYONE is playing a deceitful game. Not only the Arabs are playing it. So is the Israeli government, withholding its true intentions from the Israeli public. Here is the wrinkle in the story: The Israeli government stands to benefit from the PA reluctance to come to an agreement. But not in the way you might think. The left in Israel - today officially represented by the Netanyahu/Barak team - has done some serious thinking about the COST OF EXPULSION. The financial and moral cost could be significantly reduced if the Arabs declared UNILATERAL independence backed by the US, EU and UN. The Arabs would get their state without the government having to account to the Jews for this surrender (there's nothing we can do about it, they'll say), and Israel does not have to pay COMPENSATION to the Jews, or go through the unpleasantness of forcibly removing Jewish men, women and children from their homes. They'll tell the Jews it's up to them to evacuate. All military and police protection will be withdrawn. Only transportation and temporary housing (tents) will be made available to them. The White House supports the creation of a Palestinian state during the present administration - regardless of consequences. US government representatives gave Israel a firm deadline of two years. That was months ago. And that warning was accompanied with a threat. US Lt. Gen. Keith Dayton, in charge of the arming and training of the PA Special Forces, warned Israel that unless Palestinians get their state within that time frame, they might turn their guns on the Jews. But the story does not end with the PA unilateral declaration of independence. Of course not. The saga would continue with the demand that Gaza be united to Palestine. Israel would have to cede an additional piece of land that would cut the country in two for a Jerusalem/Gaza corridor. (The Fatah-Hamas rift will be resolved somehow.) And then the Arabs will demand the rest of Palestine. They may be nice about it. Most likely they will not. But don't despair, Israelis. Remember what President Peres advised you to do: forget about the land and build offshore artificial islands instead. This it's not so unthinkable. The government assumes that since so many Israelis are not fiercely demanding immediate ANNEXATION of their land and an end to this debilitating and self-destructive "peace" process, it means that they are accommodating folks who could feel just as home on an offshore artificial island. That's what the government thinks anyway.
19. colonel Klink?
Sean ,   Montreal, Quebec   (08.08.10)
This is some delusional rhetoric perhaps? When has the question been whether the Palestinians want peace? Is the video circulating on Youtube from Israeli channel ten with Netanyahu fake? Because Bibi seems quite clear about who killed Oslo. I realize -from earlier attempts to post the link - that the Ynet editorial staff will not permit it. This is,of course, the same editorial staff which permits the term "shiksa" to describe Chelsea Clinton. Just who is looking for peace?
20. Author I FIND ONE ERROR I STOP COLD ROOM READING
.......DACON9   (08.08.10)
Even the greatest leader to rise within Palestinian society in the past 100 years froze in place when facing the dilemma of whether to shun the value of rejectionism. NO ONE BUT YOU MR AUTHOR CALLED PALISITINA OLDER THEN 1967, MOST AGREE ARAFART DECLARED THE NAME WHAT THE ROMANS GAVE TO THE JEWS AS ARAB. MR AUTHOR CARE TO EXPLAIN? '''GREATEST LEADER IN OVER 100 YEARS?''' THE CLEANING UP OF THE ARABS OCCUPYING ISRAELI LAND WAS ONLY DUE TO ISRAELIS FAILURES TO POINT OUT THEIR DECEPTIONS If Israel acted on history and facts and not hopes and socialist liberal dreams..Israel would not be in this situation ..walking on a tightrope high wire act.... when will you face that R' MEIR KAHANE IS RIGHT'' SHARON ,OLMERT,BARAK LIVNI AND BIBI IS WRONG...
21. #5; Salma, The answer to the quetion
Mark from Georgia ,   USA   (08.08.10)
Salma writes: "Q; have you desire or ability to finalize agreement with PLO?!!!!!!!!!!! " The answer: First, Israel has completed two peace agreement with Egypt and Jordan. Israel honored both, completely. Second, the Palestinians have how MANY peace agreement under their belt? Zero! So, then we add to that, with the recent story of the Power Plant being shut down in Gaza. Why? because Hamas and the PA can't agree on payments. The Palestinians governing bodies can't even run ONE Power Plant in Gaza, how would they run a country? The onus is on the Palestinians, not Israel, a proven country, that honored its agreements vs a pseudo-Pal government that 1) never honored agreements 2) cannot even put their differences aside to run a Power Plant. CASE CLOSED
22. When are you people EVER gonna learn ?The feud is NOT about
Rueben ,   Migdal, Israel   (08.08.10)
the ever doomed peace talks. It is all about the battle between Hashem and the false god allah. Here's a hint: Hashem WINS!!! There will be a brief peace in the ME and then all hell breaks loose and allah is finally put in the pit and treated as the dog that he is. End of story. Time to move on.
23. Who in his right mind would want to?
Jerrold Cohen ,   Seal Beach, USA   (08.08.10)
Who in the world would want to negotiate with a sadistic paranoid psychopathic terrorist state addicted to blowing up your homes and stealing your land for colonization? You would have to be crazy if you wanted to negotiate with that.
24. Amazing revelation!
emmess ,   Niagara, Canada   (08.08.10)
How long does it take for the Israeli "intelligentsia" and the Left to finally "discover" what nationalist Jews have known for years? If Leftists would only listen and think before demonizing those with whom they disagree, maybe Israel would not be teetering on the brink.
25. Fundamentally, the Muslim-Arab world, local and regional,
Jehudah Ben-Israel ,   Qatzrin, Israel   (08.08.10)
is yet to accept Israel's legitimacy and the Jewish people's right to accept Israel as its way of exercising the universally accepted right of all peoples, including that of the Jewish people, to national-self determination and independence. Until and unless the Muslim-Arab world accept Israel's legitimacy as the nation-state of the Jewish people, there is little chance for peace. The only state possible is an accommodation of peaceful coexistence between Arab and Jew, between the Muslim-Arab world and Israel is based on international intervention, and that is the application of UN Security Council Resolution 242, as is. 242 does call upon Israel to withdraw its armed forces from "territories", not all of them. mind you, to "secure and recognized boundaries", not to the 1967 lines mind you. Also, 242 does not call for the setting of an additional state in the region, nor does 242 mention concepts such as "Palestine", "Palestinians" and let alone a "Palestinian state". The implication is that through talks, Egypt should take over Gaza, over which it had ruled before 1967; and Jordan should take over much of the West Bank, over which it had ruled before 1967. This may not bring "peace", but it could bring an accommodation of peaceful coexistence similar to that which presently exists between Israel and Egypt and Israel and Jordan, both of which countries reached this accommodation based on UN Security Council Resolution 24!!
26. Yes, "flying doc", now your "policing"
Robert Haymond ,   Israel/Canada   (08.08.10)
me! And I don't have the right to disagree with the opinion of another Israeli patriot? Why don't you deal with the issues? If I'm wrong in my perceptions, spell it out! Otherwise, do what you seem to do best: Hit those anti-semites where it hurts.
27. Good points, Jehudah Ben-Israel, but
Robert Haymond ,   Israel/Canada   (08.08.10)
why should Egypt take over Gaza given the problems already perpetuated by the Muslim Brotherhood which in kind and nature is not so different from Hamas? I wish this weren't the case. As to the Westbank Palestinians, it would be a great advantage to them and to us if Jordan were to incorporate them as it once did. What's the advantage to Jordan if this were done? What kind of offer could be made to entice them? Barry Rubin, a very distinguished scholar on mideast affairs (you can view his writings on his website, just google him), has an essay entitled Mideast 101. In this piece, he explains very clearly how keeping the feud between the Palestinians and Israelis going and keeping Palestinians from attaining citizenship in their (mideast Arab) own respective countries is quite advantageous as it allows the explosive anger towards their own regimes to be exercised towards Jews and Israel. In other words, as long as they have Jews and Israel around, the anger of the people towards their uncaring dictatorships can be shifted elsewhere. What do you think of Rubin's point?
28. # 27 Fundamentally, the conflict as I view it, is between...
Jehudah Ben-Israel ,   Qatzrin, Israel   (08.08.10)
...the Muslim-Arab world as a whole - the local component of it is just that, a component - and the nation-state of the Jewish people, Israel. It was the whole Muslim-Arab world that initiated the invasion of 1948. It was the whole Muslim-Arab world that stood behind Egypt-Jordan-Syria coalition that attempted in 1967 what the Muslim-Arab world could not achieve 19 years earlier. It was once again the Muslim-Arabs world that stood behind the Egypt-Syria coalition of 1973. Indeed, it was the Arab League that set up the PLO in 1964, three full years before the now disputed territories were captured by Israel, intending to "liberate" that which was Israel through the use of local gangs and thugs. It is time the Muslim-Arab world shouldered the responsibility for the mess it brought about into the region, thus Egypt must assume control over Gaza and Jordan over much of the West Bank. The way to do so is by having the international community stand by its own fundamental resolution, UN Security Council Resolution 242, AS IS. Can an Obama type administration do so? Can the regime in Russia, China, Britain and France ceasing being cynical? I don't know, but I do firmly think Israel, the tiny sovereign nation-state of a tiny people should not once again shoulder all the responsibility for that which the Muslim-Arabs brought upon themselves and the rest of the world!!! P.S. Actually, the implementing 242 as is can bring about with it very positive outcome for ALL in the region, including Egypt and Jordan, but on that at a different time.
29. #23 What America did to the Indians?
Joey Rose ,   Portland   (08.08.10)
30. #25 Yehuda
Marcella   (08.08.10)
One needs to have a long term vision for the area. How would withdrawal of any kind solve the security question? 1) Much has happened since 1967. The Gazans are not like the Egyptians and the PA Arabs too have developed their own militant culture way ahead of the Jordanians. The Gazan and PA security threat can only be managed by Israel. EVEN IF EGYPT AND JORDAN were to take the territories, where would the Gazans go, do you think? Or the militant (and armed) Fatah/Hamas? It was reported yesterday that Iran has been trying to smuggle rockets into Judea and Samaria, but cannot overcome the IDF's preventive actions. The IDF enjoys no such freedom of movement in Gaza, where similar rockets have successfully been smuggled in. (INN) That happened only days after rockets were launched from peaceful Egypt's Sinai peninsula. That goes to show how forty-three years have changed the whole picture. Israel is safer because the IDF still controls Judea and Samaria. Any Israeli withdrawal brings terror closer to Jewish cities Israel can't withdraw a single inch now. Aside from all the historical and legal reasons, Israeli control and sovereignty of the territories is of absolute and vital necessity. 2) NOBODY can force Jordan and Egypt to do anything. They just don't want the territories back and the likelihood of the USA or EU applying pressure on the Muslim world is out of the question. It's too late. And if nobody wants to take responsibility for Gaza and the PA, what's to prevent them from declaring themselves sovereign? 3) Jordanian and Egyptian stability is very fragile. We all know that the Muslim Brotherwhood or some other extreme sect may eventually take over Jordan and Egypt. What will the situation be five or ten years from now? 4) The UN is bound by previous League of Nations agreements. That UN call for Israeli withdrawal was done in violation of UN's own charter legal commitments. 5) You write: "The only state possible is an accommodation of peaceful coexistence between Arab and Jew, between the Muslim-Arab world and Israel is based on international intervention." "International" means the UN and the UN right now is the very center of the anti-Israel diplomatic war against Israel. NATO is no better, considering how the US and the EU are pandering to the Muslim world. And regarding Israel, the words INTERNATIONAL INTERVENTION are loaded with risk of the WORST possible kind. Don't even go there, Yehuda. 6) You are right that the possibility of recognition by Muslim countries is almost non-existent. Israel has to get over the complex of not being recognized by the Muslim world. As long as Israel is strong and can defend itself from attacks - Israel is being recognized! Israel would be better off with the Sinai and without the phony Egyptian peace agreement that means less and less as time goes by. Land, weapons and good political leadership are the best guarantees for Israel's security.
Next talkbacks
Back to article