News
PM to introduce amendment to Citizenship Act
Attila Somfalvi
Published: 07.10.10, 00:23
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
87 Talkbacks for this article
61. Oath of Allegiance to USA and Pledge of Allegiance to USA
(10.07.10)
"I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God" Pledge of Allegiance "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." Where do these leave room for dual loyalty as required by Mr. Netanyahu's proposed law? He's actually fooling himself if he thinks that Americans are going to give up their citizenship! Don't believe me? Just check the statistics of for the number of grandchildren born in Israel to USA citizen grandparents who are running to get citizenship!
62. Haredim first : )
Salma ,   Palestine   (10.07.10)
FOR FUTURE: So and so says I'm loyal to "Israel", Does It change People's hearts?!! change the thinking from the middle ages, can you !!!
63. Oxymoron
EM ,   Ra'anana   (10.07.10)
Pledging allegiance to Jewish & Democratic state is an oxymoron. Part of being a democracy today is that there is no distinction between religions, race or creed. (At least in countries confident that their civic moral convictions are strong enough without having to associate it to religion) How can the "Jewish" state make sure those taking the pledge are serious? Will they have to keep Kosher to prove their loyalty? Or thank HaShem every morning for not being born a woman? How about mixing cotton with wool fabrics? Checking whether the oath takers are truly loyal to the 'JEWISH' aspect of their declaration will be the end of the other aspect of the oath...democracy.
64. "aspiring citizens!"
nadav ,   tlv israel   (10.07.10)
the article says "aspiring citizens" will be required to comply with the oath, which does NOT affect the Arabs in the country since they are already citizens of this country!
65. in his zealous rush, P.M. Mr. Netanyahu has 4gotten....
(10.07.10)
that at least three American citizens have lost their American citizenship for swearing oaths of loyalty to Israel. The three Americans I am referring to are: 1. Golda Meir, z"l,Prime Minister of the State of Israel. Prior to swearing an oath of loyalty to Israel and to taking up the yoke of Prime Ministership Mrs. Meir freely surrendered her American Citizenship. 2. Mr. Moshe Arens, Ambassador of the State of Israel, Minister of Defense of the State of Israel and Foreign Minister of the State of Israel prior to taking up his post as Minister of Defense of the State of Israel surrendered his American citizenship 3. Rabbi Meir Kahane, z"l who lost his American citizenship upon becoming a Member of the Israeli Knesset. Rabbi Kahane, z"l fought a protracted battle up to the US Supreme Court arguing that he had the right to maintain both citizenships despite having freely declared an oath to the State of Israel as member of Knesset. For the record he lost that legal battle. Further as a result of his legal battle the United States State Department filed a rule stating that any American Citizen who runs for political office in a foreign nation automatically loses his/her citizenship. The State of Israel countered by creating a law which requires any citizen who wishes to run for the Knesset to surrender ALL foreign citizenships PRIOR to running for that office. Besides these three there are hundreds of other Israelis who gave up their American citizenship upon taking oaths to the State of Israel as part of becoming members of the Israeli Diplomatic corps and/or taking higher level oaths to the Israeli Defense Forces. That's just legal food for thought for all of the TBers, particularly the American ones, who think that this proposed law is a good idea. They are all forgetting that pledging an oath to a foreign state has serious ramifications and is in fact a reason for depatriation (read: removal of citizenship) from the United States.
66. to #65
EM ,   Ra'anana   (10.07.10)
Bibi also gave up his American citizenship to become a Minister in the Knesset.
67. no breath freeze, no citizenship
observer   (10.07.10)
in that way we make sure that those who don't take the pledge seriously will be eliminated.
68. PM's good idea
David   (10.07.10)
Finally a good idea from our PM-- finally something that will in fact help secure our homeland and preserve it for future generations, and not accelerate its disintegration. Kol ha kavod!!
69. 65: I have to disagree with you. An American who moved to
Rivkah   (10.07.10)
Canada and became a Canadian citizen and surrendered his U.S. citizenship found some years later that it is impossible to surrender U.S. citizenship. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled that dual citizenship is allowed but surrendering U.S. citizenship is not. That means any American who moves to another country to escape a military draft or taxes is still subject to US laws as a US citizen. The person in the court case refused to pay US taxes for ten years while in "exile" becoming a citizen of Canada. He had to pay the back taxes because the US Supreme Court ruled that a US citizen cannot surrender US citizenship since dual citizenship is recognized.
70. to #65 ammm dude, Israel wasn't USA enemy
ghostq   (10.07.10)
they moved to pledge their oathes to their state aka the state of Israel with no intention to return to USA as citizens, normal for every one, if I wanted to become USA citizens I myself would dledge my oathes to the USA, and it got no political reason what so ever, but thanks for proving that pledging oathes to the state is common thing in the west society, just wonder y Israel didn't do it till far, it's better late than never.
71. 45 Wilmandxb, M.E.: Palestinians are called Philistines in
Rivkah   (10.07.10)
the Bible and they have been in the Middle East for thousands of years. Gaza and Ashdod are historical Philistine cities. The Philistines warred anciently with the Israelites. Goliath the Giant that David slew was a Philistine. But Yahweh gave much of the land from the River of Egypt (not the Nile) to the Euphrates to the descendants of Abraham, Isaac,and Jacob. That is not the inheritance of the Palestinians. Haven't you noticed that since the Jews returned to the land Yahweh gave to them that the latter rains and prosperity have returned with them to a desolate land? The land was desolate without the rightful inheritors of the land. Yahweh has given much to Palestinians, but for them to presume that they should take from the Jews what Yahweh gave to them, is foolish. Zephaniah the Prophet tells us what will happen to the Palestinians (Philistines) if they continue to harm the Jews: all will die on the coasts of Canaan. All will die. Yahweh will kill them all. Will that be by a tsunami? An earthquake? Fire and brimstone from heaven like the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah? I don't know.
72. #1 What are you talking about?
(10.07.10)
PM Mr. Netanyahu's facebook page reads: "To do whatever it takes to ensure the security, might and prosperity of our nation" Benjamin Netanyahu 31.03.09 The page asks individuals wishing to enter the page to co-sign the Prime Minister's Pledge to his people. How exactly is that a loyalty oath to Israel? Actually using your logic if you co-signed his oath then you may wish to consider yourself his co-Prime Minister! LMAO! falling off my chair LMAO!Imagine you co-prime minister of the State of Israel! Now that is just too rich for the real citizens of the state of Israel!
73. #66 please verify your information
#65   (10.07.10)
Mr. Netanyahu according to his own declaration was never a citizen of the United States. The US citizenship story for Mr. Netanyahu is an urban legend along the same lines as the urban legend which states that the current US President Mr. Obama was actually born in Kenya! It's just not true!
74. #69 u r 100% wrong!
#65   (10.07.10)
In 1971 my brother left the United States as a draft dodger from the US draft for the Viet Nam war. He came to live in Israel where he became a citizen of Israel and served bravely in the Yom Kippur War. His draft dodging in the United States was depatrizing action which caused him to lose his US citizenship. His US citizenship was restated only AFTER US President Mr. Carter granted a general pardon to all draft dodgers from the Viet Nam War thereby opening the road for all those who had dodged the US draft to reclaim their US citizenship. I refer you to Post 61 who copied the Oath of Allegiance to the USA which in part says: "that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law;" In choosing to draft the US draft my brother violated that section of the oath and lost his citizenship.
75. #70: ghostq, dude I'm a dudette!
#65, a dudette! ,   Israel   (10.07.10)
I see where you are going with your point and perhaps in the cases of Mrs. Meir, z"l and Mr. Arens, may he live in good health, you are correct. But not in the case of Rabbi Meir Kahane, z"l. If it was his intent never to return to the USA as a citizen or to maintain his US citizenship he wouldn't have fought a protracted legal battle of the nature he carried out. Wishing you a lovely day
76. to 73
EM ,   Ra'anana   (10.07.10)
Bibi (AKA Ben Nitay) claimed to have given up his dual citizen rights in 1982 in order to join the Knesset. Maybe that's where the 'urban legend' sprang up. It wouldn't be the first time that Bibi is the source of misinformation about himself.
77. It is not racist, it does not discriminate
Yerushalmi ,   Jerusalem   (10.07.10)
It should deny citizenship to extreme leftists and nature karta, not only arabs. Good riddance.
78. Bibi threw a bone!
tanya ,   tel aviv israel   (10.07.10)
79. to EM @76 agreed! and i'm chuckling w/u!
#73   (10.07.10)
80. Whats the big deal?
Moshe ,   Jerusalem   (10.07.10)
In many countries when one receives citizenship they take an oath or make a pledge of allegiance. Best example is the United States Oath of Allegiance "I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God." It is very clear about upholding the constitution and about enemy's both foreign and domestic as well as army and national service as necessary . So no we dont need the oath here in Israel to say Jewish, BUT the declaration of statehood is very clear that Israel was to be established as a Jewish homeland, and that, that would be the nature of its character. While guaranteeing freedom of religion and freedom from discrimination for all. This does not make acknowledging the founding principles and the fact that it was created as a home (state) for all Jews racist or discriminatory.
81. Homeland for Jews, But One-Fifth Muslim Guys
Dav Lev ,   Burbank,CAUSA   (10.07.10)
I admit this is a good one for the word experts. Look guys, even though Israel is a Jeiwish homeland, it does have huge secular pop. and other faiths. (1/5 Muslim). Leave the "Jewish" out of the pledge..and I concur. in the USA, I pledge..and sing the patriotic song before games, etc. We dont sing hatikvah. The separation clause is our law..and a good one. Israel needs a constitution,..defining it..state of teh Jews, a Jewish state, a homeland for Jews but a democracy for all...that would clear up lots of things. Hows bout it guys? Would the ultra-Orthodox recite such a pledge..hmmm, I wonder/. Lets be frnak, putting Jewish into a pledge, changes its meaning and value.
82. Jewish people are a NATION, a PEOPLE more than a religion
Jae ,   Lynn US   (10.07.10)
Anyone can become Jewish whether they are eskimo irish arab chinese slavic turk aboriginee germanic. Not every Jew is religious, clearly, so our foundation is more as a people with history rather than a religion our being a people. This declaration recognizes that will will be democratic is a nation- equal rights for all citizens, religious atheist secualr, jew non jew white black red olive...yet, existentially- by surivor mode it will stay demographically and existentially the nation state of the Jewish people, with its loyal friends as full and equal partners. Good things!
83. #45wildman
Jae ,   Lynn US   (10.07.10)
Jews were born there too. The whole earth belongs to God, man is a transitory homeowner who is born and dies. God gave it to the nations before Israel 1000s of years ago and then decided to give it to Israel. It is Gods choice. Do you ask arabs to give back north africa to the berber peoples? Do you ask the USA to give back its land to the west Indians? No you dont. and in this case the Jews are the INDIGENOUS people of Judea (JEW-dee-a), not the Arabs who are indigenous of Arabia (ARAB-ee-a). Argue these points, if you have something to say.
84. ALL Israels should take the Oath of Allegiance!
Galilean ,   The Galil, Israel   (10.07.10)
I am a Jewish Agnostic but I firmly believe that Israel is the home of the Jewish People and the only real home they have. American children recite the Oath of Allegiance every day at school. How many Israeli classrooms have an Israeli standing in a place of honor? I worked for many years in a government department and the only Israeli flag was in the office of the boss. I even blew my cool when no Israeli flag was hoisted for Yom Ha'Atzmaut! In most countries the national flag flies on all national institutions. Not here in Israel. Its just too much trouble! This country is the only entity which protects Jews, the scapegoats of the world, from Holocaust 2 and we should be thankful for it! Instead, we have apathy and indifference. It is the same apathy and indifference that sent 6 million of or people to the gas chambers! This is not a matter of right or left. This is a matter of honor to the country that protects, feeds and educates YOUR children be they Jew, Christian, Muslim or other. It is a country founded by Jews and by the blood of Jews and is and always be the Jewish State! Maybe those anti-Zionists would like to live under Sharia Law or Christian Fundamantalism. Those who condemn nationalist feeling are very quich to demand government hand outs from the National Isurance Institute and enjoy the full beneits of Medical Insurance but are not prepared to respect our country and beliefs. If you don't like it then get out!
85. Israeli Arab leaders should keep mum
observer   (10.07.10)
the more they object, the higher the price Israel's leader will request, in order to give it up, during the peace talk with PA.
86. #45 Wildmandxb
Phil ,   Ireland   (10.07.10)
You say "Palestinians were born THERE!" Well Yasser Arafat was a "Palestinian" and he was born in Cairo!! How many other "Palestinians" born there were born somewhere else?
87. Diffine what democratic and Jewish means
Simantov ,   Jerusalem Israel   (10.10.10)
This bill is being rammed through in a clear demonstration of the lack of democracy. And what does it mean to be a Jewish state? Who will decide that? It must be by the standard that God established and that is scripture, not these religious rabbis who are seeking their own religious goals. The bible is the one who establishes Jewishness. Its very first meaning is a people who praise God. The God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, to be a true Jew is to worship Him. This can never be legislated but it is by faith in Him. I am very concerned about this undemocratic law, because the interpritation is left in the hands of men that do not know the true meaning of being a Jew.
Previous talkbacks
Back to article