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National Religious choose stricter lifestyle
Akiva Novick
Published: 18.11.10, 08:15
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24 Talkbacks for this article
1. Control of mind and person
Yakov ,   Tel Aviv   (11.18.10)
Peter Pan? Certainly an example of perversity! I'm equally convinced that literary masterpieces, such as Harry Potter, should be similarly shunned. What's next? Book burning? Religious police, public beatings? If this is the kind of society you wish to build, then I can save you the work. Their is a place, not far from here where that kind of paranoid control is already built. It is called Iran. Many Jews used to live there, maybe you should consider returning.
2. "It's a trend"
Harry ,   Jerusalem   (11.18.10)
So you think, living by the Torah, is a trend? Where ever you go, down the water down lane of Judaism, the reality will hit you in the face and either you drown further into secularism or return to the proper way of living a Jewish Torah life. The Torah Life is not a TREND, IT IS LIFE ITSELF. The water down version of attempted Judaism, is a TREND, that changes with the seasons, wind, OR HOW I FEEL.
3. Way to go!
Shalom Hartman   (11.18.10)
4. #1
AL ,   Tel Aviv   (11.18.10)
These are the rules and ways of the Jewish religion and this the Jewish state. I suggest you go west or return to cyberspace if you are seeking the "freedoms" you desire.
5. #1-you obviously have no concept of balance
brl ,   Israel   (11.18.10)
No one is saying that Israel should become like iran, but most religious people here actually know how to balance their lives. We dont want to be like Iran, but that doesnt mean we have to accept the level of decadence that Israeli secular society is reaching.
6. It's a fact.
Israel   (11.18.10)
Demographics show that in a few years the only Jews left will be ultraorthodox . Seculars intermarry, leave the fold, their children will be goyim. These MIzrachnikim (Dati Leumi) realize that unless they start being more religious in the end they will go the way of the dodo bird. I'm not judging who's better, I'm just stating the facts.
7. How many of religious public there are?
John ,   Europe   (11.18.10)
8% of haredim, 12% of datim. Makes 20% of whole Israel. One in 5 is religious and only his hand and leg (and maybe an index finger of other hand) are haredi. Yes, it is a trend, but by all definitions, it is MARGIN trend, not a MAINSTREAM trend.
8. "real Jewish music"?
Smith ,   TA, Israel   (11.18.10)
As in, not Ha'Yehudim, Knesiat Ha'Sechel, Shlomi Artzi or Yeduit Ravitz. No, not treasure of Israeli culture that can transform our image from one of a crazy militaristic religious country to an image of a normal country that produces culture. No, what we need is "real Jewish music" which according to a rabbinical ruling is not allowed to have female singers, not to have a rhythmic drum beat and should not have the normal pentameter of music. It should sound like Yiddish music so Mizrachi music is also not kosher. La'azazel
9. were old days golden?
observer   (11.18.10)
Racist Zionism violates the Orthodox Judaism position of no return to Zion before the Messiah returns and was an extension of Western European racist nationalism and racist colonialism. According to the American Jewish Identity Survey (2001), less than 22% of all Jews declare themselves Zionist.
10. religion is the opiate of the people
observer   (11.18.10)
And these, having been exposed to both sides of Israeli life, have chosen religion. Real addicts, aren't they?
11. #1 what are you complaining about.
rebecca ,   Modiin   (11.18.10)
These people dont like what you are doing but instead of complaining, they are doing something. Not stopping you, but giving themselves alternatives. What are you upset about? Think your kids might like what they're doing? Scary thought.
12. Destructive Tel Aviv "Culture"
TelAvivDinosaurs ,   Jerusalem Israel   (11.18.10)
All comments by the left about the religious public should be dismissed and be taken as collectors items they are sent by the dying last hold outs of the failed left purveyors of secular extremism that has unfortunately led millions of our youth here & abroad(with the help of our media of course ) to help create the demographic and political chaos the Jewish people find themselves here and abroad so dismiss them as the last of the "dinosaurs"& work to undue the damage as quickly as possible & make sure it never happens again.
13. The more liberal TelAvivim will behave
Trumpeldor ,   eurabyeh   (11.18.10)
the more Srugot will flee away from them And when you contemplate the fruits of liberal lifestyle,you understand the way of Srugot !
14. Brain washing for the masses
Avi ,   Israel   (11.18.10)
Just goes to show how vulnerable some people can be. then they loose the basic ability to think for themselves and follow every word their rabbi says, trouble is no ones checking out the rabbis.
15. "Peter Pan" a 'bad influence???'
Chaya ,   Tel Aviv   (11.18.10)
It used to be that the National Religious were not affected by the extremism of the Hareidi. I don't like the direction they are going in.
16. Just shows how braiwashed
not the mashiach   (11.18.10)
the masses are that they (want to)believe all the anti jewish religion rubbish printed in Ynet
17. Peter Pan for Hanuka???
m   (11.18.10)
Exactly what the Macabees fought against. Israel today=Hellenism in its most depraved, but nobody who sits in it can smell it. A breath of fresh air from the observant can be detrimental,
18. What this leads to
Max   (11.18.10)
This type of education produces Yigal Amir and all the Shas MPS who have been in jail. Good luck. Rav Kook is turning over in his grave.
19.  A Mother's Tears
(11.18.10)
Yair Eitan’s father ran a produce distribution business in Northern Israel. When Yair was old enough, he began driving the delivery truck. One of his regular deliveries was at Yeshivah Lev V’Nefesh, whose student body was primarily comprised of baalei teshuvah. Yair’s parents had carefully shielded him from his religion; his upbringing was strictly secular. The joy and excitement Yair saw within the yeshivah walls aroused his curiosity. He allowed himself to be drawn into conversation with a few yeshivah students. On his third trip there, Yair was already sitting down for a few minutes to sample Torah study. When Yair finally told his parents what he had discovered in the yeshivah, his father became enraged. "No son of mine is going to become a backward, bearded chareidi! You are no longer to deliver to that route and you are forbidden to visit that yeshivah, or any other yeshivah, ever again!" Yair knew that one must obey one’s father, except when a parent explicitly commands a child to disobey the Torah. He continued to clandestinely visit the yeshivah. But his father found out, and he reacted violently. Yair, however, was determined. He inquired as to other available yeshivos, left a note wishing his parents well, and left without revealing his destination. His father searched for him and forced him to return home. Not only that, he blamed the Rosh Yeshivah of Lev V’Nefesh and filed charges against him of brainwashing his 18-year-old son and of engineering his flight from home. The trial aroused great interest, and the trial date found a packed courtroom eagerly awaiting to hear the proceedings. Yair’s testimony did not help the prosecution at all. Yair insisted that he had not been coerced to attend the yeshivah; it was of his own volition. While Yair was recounting his story, the judge presiding over the case, an elderly man, seemed a bit distracted. He would intermittently take his eyes off the speaker to gaze intently at Yair’s father. When Yair left the witness stand, the judge announced, "I would like Mr. Eitan to step forward." Yair’s father was surprised as he stepped up to the witness stand. The judge asked if he was of Eastern European descent, if his name back in Europe was perhaps "Stark". Mr. Eitan was clearly taken aback, and he stammered that the judge was indeed correct. "And are you originally from Pinsk?" asked the judge. Mr. Eitan nodded meekly. The judge continued, "I remember you well. You come from one of the finest homes of pre-War Pinsk. Your father was a deeply religious and highly respected man. Your mother was renowned for her kindness. She would cook meals for the poor and the sick regularly. I remember well when, as an 18-year-old, you openly departed from your parents’ ways. When you publicly desecrated the Shabbos for the first time, your father aged overnight and seemed to be constantly in mourning. Your mother would shed a river of tears every Friday night when she lit the candles. I often wondered what became of all her tears. I’m not the most religious person, but I know that there is a G-d who runs this world, and I could not understand how the tears of so righteous a woman could be ignored in Heaven. "Today my question has been answered. I see that her tears were not shed in vain. Today, almost 50 years later, her grandson has returned to the ways of his ancestors. Mr. Eitan, I’m sure you recall that on more than one occasion, friends of your parents pleaded with you that for your parents’ sake you should at least refrain from public transgression. As I recall, your response was, ‘I’m now eighteen and I make my own decisions. I can live my life any way I please.' And you dare to file charges because your eighteen-year-old son has returned to the ways that you abandoned?” “Case dismissed.”
20. There is a whole world outside the haredi neighborhood
Raymond in DC ,   Washington, USA   (11.18.10)
What's troubling about this trend is that while the "religious" think they are being true to themselves, they are walling themselves off from a world they're incapable of dealing with. Will they be able to walk on the streets with people of the other gender? Study a discipline or work in an office or business establishment that requires dealing with people unlike themselves? Travel in a mixed gender environment? The Jews of earlier eras - whether living in the Roman diaspora, in Iberia, or even in Eastern Europe, they needed the tools to confront the world around them while retaining their values and traditions. A community that fears the sciences, talking to a woman, or (horrors!) Harry Potter is incapable of doing so.
21. Sorry guys, but this just ain't happening in the field
Brian Cohen ,   Judean Peoples Front   (11.18.10)
Get a grip, Novick. The "national religious public" is NOT setting up a separate society. Actually, the reality is quite the opposite: national religious people serve in the army with all the seculars; we work in every industry and public institution with no limits, we own and watch televisions and listen to regular radio, we go to the beaches including mixed beaches. We go to the same universities as other people, ride the same buses, and shop in the same stores. Do some of us want more modesty in society? Yes. Are we setting up new institutions to separate ourselves from society? No way. Novick is simply out of touch with reality.
22. Secular are slaves of mind. Slaves to religion of
Tzedek ,   Israel   (11.18.10)
pseduo pleasure that keeps you addicted, you are rarely fulfilled though. Funny how some secularists think orthodox are brainwashed. Look at the billboards, look at the rape, look at the crime, look at the overall nastiness- those are not Jewish Torah values. Similarly Orthodoxy needs to focus on the spirit more than the ruitual because right now its the opposite. Ideal is more like 50/50; you need both....better to help someone out than to make sure you have minutely performed a mitzvah according to the standards set in the 18th century europe, 3000 years after Sinai, and 3000 yrs after the original rulings..
23. Live and let live..
Jeremy ,   Michigan USA   (11.18.10)
As long as no one is forcing someone else to do something .. why does anyone care? If a community wants to stay closed within their community that is fine, just don't expect everyone else to live by your rules. Don't restrict my secular/spiritual life and I won't restrict your religious life. See now we can both be happy.
24. a wholesome life
(08.30.11)
What no one seems to understand is that most of us want our children to grow up in a wholesome world without perversity. ANYONE who cares about this will seek to fill their child's lives with a beautiful holy way of life. The Torah offers that life. The dati Leumi treasure it. All media which promotes a decadent life has no place in a wholesome environment.
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