Jewish Scene
Give me children or give me death
Sarit Rosenblum
Published: 02.12.10, 08:59
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1. the brainless sheep
Haim ,   Tel aviv   (12.02.10)
Natuarly this is sad news for the women in question , from the article we do not know if she already has children, if so they will be motherless, what is trully sad is that this women has lost the ability to think for herself and needs to consult a rabbi in order to make a decision. Unfortuenly no one is checking the rabbis, which with all these cases of child abuse within the ultra orthdox community is a very worring factor.
2. Darwin, Survival of the Fitest. She is fixated on a goal of
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (12.02.10)
motherhood and she could adopt children and be an excellent mother but she will cheat those children by dying. She can die and again prove Darwin correct. You can't force someone to be rational, only coax them.
3. Suggestion
Moshe R ,   Ariel, Israel   (12.02.10)
Can't she have a few eggs taken out of her and frozen?
4. #3
Rasjie ,   Jerusalem Israel   (12.02.10)
Nice suggestion but without a uterus where would the embryo be growing?
5. #4 - In a the womb of one of those poor women...
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (12.02.10)
...who sell their bodies as surrogates. Actually, it is her right to die if that is what she wants. Goodness knows some of us fought long and hard for the right to have a living will that is accepted in Israel, and may I add that that fight was against the religious fundamentalists that opposed them. She is a grown woman, let her make her own choice for whatever reason. It's not that she is refusing to allow medical treatment for a child because of her fanaticism.
6. # 4
I know   (12.02.10)
Without a uterus the eggs can grow In Utero it'll be like Nirvana
7. M's situation
rachel   (12.02.10)
i am sorry she has cancer. she should have given her eggs and found a surrigate to carry her and her husband's child. she should have realized that a cancerous womb will never be able to give life....and now she is going to die.
8. 3 Moshe R., Ariel, Israel: The cancer has spread to her
Rivkah   (12.02.10)
ovaries, so she cannot have some ovum frozen in nitrogen for a surrogate mother to have children for her. Lance Armstrong, the bicyclist, had his sperm frozen before chemo so he could have children by in vitro fertilization after his cancer was under control.
9. The sister of President Jimmy Carter was in a similar
Rivkah   (12.02.10)
situation but she was older and refused surgery. She sought faith healing and died. I had a similar condition at age 36 and opted for surgical removal of all reproductive parts. I have lived another 22 years so far. A woman I met twenty years ago told me she was diagnosed with cervical cancer when she was pregnant with her daughter. She was told to have her uterus removed or she would die. She chose to have the child and let God take care of the cancer. Both mother and child are still alive today. The hysterectomy was performed at the birth of her child. My sister-in-law in Ohio had fibroid tumors in the uterus and had a hysterectomy after having three children and grieved that she could not give her husband a son because she could no longer have children. It is a catastrophic time of life for a woman to face surgical menopause and infertility. A girlfriend in Colorado had ovarian cancer and had to have her ovaries and uterus removed a couple of years ago and had chemo and radiation. The cancer spread to her liver (metastasized) and she is still living even though elderly. She would be dead without the surgery. Emperor Napoleon's sister Paolina had reproductive tract cancer and died in her early thirties since there were no surgical interventions then. It may be too late for surgical intervention, so I would suggest she elevate tissue oxygen levels with 2cc Cellfood (Nobel Laureate formula) in a cup of water twice a day indefinitely. Add to that nanoparticlized silver solution 10cc twice daily. Add to that 1 cup Flor-Essence tea three times daily. Nanoparticlized silver solution gel should be squirted into her vagina near the cervix several times a day. Asking the Sharons (Ariel, Omri, and Gilad) to pray for her would be helpful, too. They are powerful when it comes to healing the sick by asking YHWH to intervene. Rabbi Yeshua said there is no greater love than to lay down one's life for a friend. For this young woman to choose death is a way to free her husband to have children by another wife. That sounds foolish but it can reflect the greatest love a person can have. Lastly, the woman need to go to Sheba Medical Center in Tel Hashomer and speak to Omri and Gilad Sharon and ask them to ask their father to pray for her. There is power with YHWH in that family for healing that is remarkable.
10. In the end
The Last Zionist ,   Eilat   (12.02.10)
She will be buried outside the fence. It's very sad.
11. #9 + #10
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (12.02.10)
#9 "For this young woman to choose death is a way to free her husband to have children by another wife." Psssst! Jews can divorce, we aren't like Catholics. And if he is too decent to divorce a dying woman, he can request permission from the rabbis to take a second wife. That too, is allowed. Finally, he can have a legitimate child by another woman, even if he is married, just as long as the other woman isn't married. #10 - The religious authories will not be seeing her choice as sucide. Just the opposite. They will probably eulogise her as a true woman of valour, putting her faith in gd and not those silly doctors.
12. Naive and silly
Daniel Breslauer ,   Jerusalem   (12.02.10)
She is probably 'sure' that she won't die because G-d will save her with a big miracle. After all her friends and family are saying Tehilim all day long. While I'm religious, I'm open to science as well, particularly medicine. Diseases are caused by well known genetic factors and environmental factors, cancer in particular. There is nothing from G-d about such diseases, they appear by mechanisms we are quite aware of (if not 100%), it is nothing supernatural. Just pure science.
13. so what?
observer   (12.02.10)
Does Ynet report every time someone refuses life-saving treatment, or only when the person is haredi (according to Ynet's standards)? She's an adult and has the right to refuse. If she has made this decision, even on the weirdest of pretexts, it's her life and her decision must be respected. If she would refuse a heart or liver transplant would she have been subjected to the same criticism? Definitely not.
14. What about adoption?
Ex-Orthodox Jew ,   Israel   (12.02.10)
Isn't an adopted child considered halachically as "yours" as a child born of your womb? Aren't there many Jewish orphans to be adopted? Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. (Isaac Newton)
15. Good point, No. 14
Rich ,   Toronto, Canada   (12.02.10)
Why should she kill herrself, when she can opt out for adoption?
16. 11 Dorothy Friend, Tel Aviv: Thanks for the information.
Rivkah   (12.02.10)
Looks like there are lots of alternatives for this woman to have a family if she has the surgery, if it is not too late for the surgical intervention.
17. to #14 that's an Einstein quote
david ,   uk   (12.02.10)
18. Medicine tells Lies
Avigail Cassel ,   Sydney Australia   (12.02.10)
Kol a KVod to this young woman who is sensible enough to know that Medicine does not hold the answers to health problems. There are many natural therapies that can address this situation very well without the need to hack her to pieces like the so called "doctors of destruction" prescription. Legendendary doctor Dr. Rudoft Breuss said "To my mind, healing means returning a malfunctioning human body to full unrestricted function, not to remove parts of it by operation or amputation. Does Mutilation equal Healing? How can an organ, partly or completely removed, become a cured organ?" Dr. Breuss has also written extensively about removing cancers from the body by a simple fast supported by healing teas. Vitamin B17 is also well known for cancer fighting properties as well as many herbs that can be easily supplied by a Western or Eastern Herbalist. Medicine is nothing more than an arrogant, destructive pharmaceutical Whore who's only mode is Butchery. I am with this woman 100%. May Hashem show her the path of healing and provide her with many children for years to come. To all those who want to force their degraded and disgusting methodology on others I would say - Watch out - Vengeance will follow.
19. No. 16
Dorothy Friend ,   Tel Aviv   (12.02.10)
She doesn't have the alternatives, her husband does. And to the person who mentioned transplants -- I know a haredi chap that refused to have a transplant from someone who died on principle. Sounds cool and noble, sticking to his religion, right? So he went to a country where he could buy a kidney from some poor guy that needed to feed his family. I never asked him why one of his coreligionists from the same "court" or another court wasn't ready to donate a kidney of his own to a fellow Jew.
20. My deepest heartfelt sympathy for the woman. I wonder though
Jae ,   Lynn US   (12.02.10)
whiule this is something that no one should ask for, what about the possibility of raising children?\ Lord knows how many Jews have been murdered by Arab terrorists, with little orphans in so many communities? She could help raise a tiny fraction of them.
21. slow news day huh?
Ellen ,   Israel/USA   (12.02.10)
t# 1--it says she has yet to give birth--she has no kids! The question is why did YNET use the convoluted wording that it did. #13--you are totally correct YNET needs to find news--this isn't news. This is a private matter, it effects no one! The only result of it being published is to feed the anti-Hareidi that read this site. ( and I am not Hareidi and frequently disagree with much of what they do.
22. Women aren't obligated to reproduce.
Stan ,   USA   (12.02.10)
This woman clearly didn't ask a Rabbi. Her putting her ability to have kids over her own life defies reason and halacha.
23. To Rivkah.
Felicia ,   Israel.   (12.02.10)
I love all your talkbacks, you seem so KIND.!
24. Did it EVER occur to any of you?
Alon ,   Jerusalem   (12.02.10)
Did it ever occur to any of you that this woman is scared out of her mind and isn't handling it rationally? Judaism does not support her choice and I doubt many rabbis would. Instead of it being a stick to beat the religious (ho hum...here we go again), YNET should leave it to the authorities, who will, I hope, convince the husband and family. This is a sad story - not worthy of the gleeful chance you all are taking to yet again (ho hum) bash the religion.
25. This is against Halacha
Allon   (12.02.10)
The poor women is crazy, her life comes before everything else, the Halacha couldn't be clearer.
26. who says its about religion???
brl   (12.02.10)
My aunt had a hysterectomy. The surgery through her whole body so off balance hormone wise that she has been chemically severely depressed ever since, and no hormone therapy is helping. Her life has been miserable ever since. I think most people posting on here have no idea what kind of havoc a full hyterectomy can cause a young woman. This woman has every reason to fear this, and this may not be connected to religion at all. This woman obviously has an incredible fear of not being able to have children. I know many women who feel the same way who are not orthodox, and it was also one of my biggest fears in life. There is no way the Rabbis' are encouraging her not to have the surgery - they are just deciding if she has a right to abstain. The fact that she is ultra-orthodox has nothing to do with it. I know many non jewish/non religious people who have decided getting treatment for cancer. To all you judgemetal a-holes, hopefully non of you will ever have a dream as big has bringing a child into the world, and then have to make a decision like she has to make.
27. This is against Jewish law!
Chaya ,   Tel Aviv   (12.02.10)
An abortion is mandated if carrying the child to full term would result in the death of the mother. Life comes first!!
28. Rivkah! If there ever was a time 4 u 2 b silent this is it!
Peppermint Paddy ,   right here right now   (12.02.10)
(Unfortunately) We are all aware of your knowledge, your christianity and your wealth of personal life experiences. But really this time you have crossed a line even for me... Please do learn to distinguish between times when your posts are welcome, when your posts are an annoyance and when your posts are just the wrong thing to be doing! This is one of those times. Enough! As Rashi wrote: "Woman! You are a gadfly! Be Silent!"
29. May G-d open her eyes and heart & may He also quiet down...
(12.02.10)
the wagging lips of so many wise TBers! and say ye "Amen!"
30. What is her rabbi waiting for?!
(12.02.10)
May G-d move him to action for this is a medical emergency!
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