Jewish Scene
Rabbi: IDF degrading religious public
Kobi Nahshoni
Published: 14.09.11, 15:40
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22 Talkbacks for this article
1. A reminder
Israel Israeli ,   Tel Aviv   (09.14.11)
Rabbi Melamed's yeshiva was removed from the Hesder arrangement by Ehud Barak. Barak sent the Shayetet soldiers to the Mavi Marmara unarmed, risking their lives, forcing them to kill terrorists, and ultimately leading to the crisis with Turkey. Barak allowed Gilad Shalit to be kidnapped. For no reason, Barak also called off the "Cast Lead" rescue operation before Shalit was rescued. Barak was elected by the Labor Party voters. He betrayed his voters by setting up the "Independence" party so he and a few corrupt croneys could get Ministerial positions complete with cars and very generous salaries.
2. Living on myths, fake rules. Why not degrade them?
Michael ,   California, USA   (09.14.11)
3. and the good Rabbi served in which branch of the IDF....?
Zionist ,   Israel   (09.14.11)
4. make saudis look like angels
Rami of Nazareth ,   Israel   (09.14.11)
Such behavior by haredi jews make the backward saudis look like angels in their treatment of women.
5. Lone voice?
Leon Zacharowicz MD ,   New York   (09.14.11)
Will he be a lone voice? Where are the rest? The sound of silence is deafening. This episode harkens back to the 1950s and 1960s and will only lead to further schism if those responsible for this debacle are not disciplined, as he rightfully suggests.
6. I agree.
noa ,   israel   (09.14.11)
We are a Jewish country. If religious Jews are not allowed to see women singing (no matter how abhorrent to me personally), they should not have to go against their beliefs.
7. extremism is bad, even for the IDF
Larry ,   Los Angeles   (09.14.11)
Extreme behavior is normally a sign of problematic personalities that have difficulty in dealing with in between shades of good and bad. The commander of the group exhibited a distorted reaction when several religious men walked out. He should have understood that this was not a rebellion against him or the IDF but merely a person adhering to his religious beliefs. The commander should be instructed as to the essence of what a religious person is, instead of taking an extreme stance and screwing up. If the commander can not apologize he should be asked to leave.
8. Oh please, Rami
American Sabrah ,   Israel   (09.14.11)
Saudis and like many many Muslims living in the middle east wouldn't allow women to make public appearances let alone to hold concerts at all. Judaism allows women to sing but Jewish men are forbidden to listening to any female singer above the age of 12 who are not related to them. These cadets are not trying to coerce their religious beliefs upon the rest of the IDF. A the same time, the army should respect them for it and not force them in a predicament. I could use the same logic and accuse you of slacking off just because you don't want to work on your holidays. The last time I checked, Islam permits wife beating while Judaism explicitly forbids it. Fundamental Christianity is not much more tolerant towards women's rights either. Judaism is more progressive than both religions combined, fyi.You may want to review your sources before you make ridiculous statements like that.
9. and where does this end...
IMC ,   Israel   (09.14.11)
will the voice of a female soldier issuing orders to male soldiers be ignored?
10. crackpots
Dave ,   Canada   (09.14.11)
where intheTorah or inthe mesoret isa woman not allowed to sing? The logical next step is to forbid a woman to speak in the company of males (heaven forbid someone might get an erection) There is no end to Haradi stupidity and ugliness
11. yes
JE ,   USA   (09.15.11)
Over the centuries there have been rabbis that prohibit even a female speaking voice, and other rabbis who ruled that ONLY women's voices singing love songs are prohibited. Different rabbis have different takes on Kol Isha -- so the IDF should worry about each soldier following each rabbi's ruling? NO. Women in the IDF must be respected when performing in legitimate memorial or patriotic services. This was not a casual entertainment program.
12. Are they serious?
Norman Gellman ,   Rehovot   (09.15.11)
The women’s voice issue is serious in a military environment. First of all we must realize that this so called Halachic requirement is based on a time when women were kept in seclusion and not seen as an everyday occurrence. Officers in the IDF have to lead troops in to battle and must do what they can to prevent casualties. Can you imagine a situation of an officer ignoring a danger warning because it came from a female? Extreme religion does not belong in the IDF.
13. Rabbi Eliezer, how dare you?
Jew1 ,   Ashdod   (09.15.11)
How dare you to demand such a unjustified request? This commander is in the army because he is ready to die for his country. He is in army because he believe in defending our country and loves to see her prosper. Do not dare to dis-respect any of our officers. You don't earn that command and respect. You people have messed up lot of things and given this country almost 20% of non-working non-contributing paracites. Do not compair your rights to the rights of a great soldier. All I see from this story, that you all are not here to serve in IDF for love of your country but to concur another destination to turn it in your mess. IDF please make a note, all Europe fall pray to extreme muslims because everytime they gave them what they want, just to avoid conflicts. Today they wish that they would have sotpped it before. We are standing on that border where they stood before. Do not even give a inch to these fanatism or they will demand the whole terriotory and our whole country will pay the price. We need IDF the way it is and not another bogus yashiva pretending to defend it's country...
14. No. 4 Rami
NYC Girl   (09.15.11)
As an atheist, I couldn't be more diametrically opposed to everything about the Haredim. But, having said that, come back and talk to us the next time there's an honor killing in a Haredi community.
15. This is no Israel's tradition. Rabbi is degrading IDF.
Miron ,   USA   (09.15.11)
The tzadikim should get out of IDF and eat pork free sandwich. Sharon ate bacon every Saturday morning. In our army we need holy Sharons, not their holy messiah. Practically speaking, Israel needs African refugee camps in Sinai. For the past longest in the world 2 years. Only political coward like Netaneyahoo can continue to ignore absolute nessessity of our state.
16. Hatred for religious
Michael ,   New York   (09.15.11)
I want to remind all the commentators who are criticizing the rabbi for not serving in the army, and criticizing the parasites, that this is the rabbi of a hesder yeshiva, whose students DO serve in the army, and he is complaining that the army isnt helping them serve. Once they serve, they work. For those that criticize religious jews for not serving, i dont understand how you also criticize him - seems like you criticize those who serve, and those who dont serve. Hard for me to see that as anything but simple hatred for the religious
17. #15
Tamar ,   Jerusalem   (09.15.11)
Yes, and look where is Sharon now...he really did a lot of good to us eating bacon every Saturday morning speacialy abusing his own people, we really need a lot like Sharon, to give more to the palestinians and let his people still live in a caravan somewhere with their families-IF they still have one after Gush Katif. Maybe the pork sandwich made him decide such a thing, and brought us also the peace,of course...what a pitty he can not do that anymore! But, what would i know?I am the one running to the shelter every day in Israel, not in Usa. People like you like to talk a lot,you know better from USA how we should live here...Maybe you can teach us Miron!Yes, you shoud give us a big lesson-from experience of course...
18. Now the Datim Are Victims?
Gordon ,   New York USA   (09.15.11)
After all that the Haredim have done to tear down the pillars of Israeli democracy, they are accusing the IDF of victimizing them? My goodness...
19. Knowing the word of God helps
Singer Female ,   UK   (09.15.11)
Were the rabbis to know their scriptures as well as the notzrim you would know that the Lord send singers to set spiritual ambushes. (Chronicles) There is a song of Moyshe and a Song of Debra. Cheer up, we came, WE SANG, WE CONQUERED...then we went home. "He's the Mighty God of Israel and His VOICE shall be heard in the Power of His Word....." (in song)
20. The parasites of mankind, RELIGION.
Sigmund   (09.15.11)
Those idiots from har braha want to dictate to the IDF a new line of conduit. Fire the whole IDF staff for the humiliating dismissal of 4 cadets who prefer to listen to their stupid, incompetant and worthless rabbis instead of Colonels and regiment commanders. The new 2012 IDF under the command of Field Marshal rabbi melamed. Yuck ! !
21. No.16- please advise
Jew1 ,   Ashdod   (09.15.11)
How do the haredim wants to serve? This is just a starting point. Tomorrow they will refuse to get training with female soldiers, then they will refuse to have a senior lady commander, then they will refuse to each and every entertainment or casual function to have normal songs and female musicians and singers, then they will object to have same seats for men and woman in such functions, then they will object that the food is not ultra-kosher etc. and on the day when they are needed, it is Saturday! This list will go on and on and on. Please understand that army is not a computer game. This is reality. Their objection will come on the account of all females in IDF who took equal share defending this country from it's formation. She took her responsibility and went in front when you all slept on the name of religion. And what is this religious propaganda that looses it's control on the site female voice? All they think is seducing voice? Why they don't have mothers and sisters? Keep our army away from your bullshit. If these soldiers have problem then ask them to put earphones. Our IDF is not playhouse of your rabbies. It is umbrella that protects me and my children day and night.
22. the only thing keeping this Rabbi alive and kicking is IDF
JEWbilation ,   NYC, USA   (09.16.11)
ungrateful....
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