Jewish Scene
Ukrainians protest Jewish pilgrimage
AP and Stav Spivak
Published: 26.09.11, 08:20
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1. Who cares about Uman?
American Sabrah ,   Israel   (09.26.11)
Holidays are meant to be spent with families; not flying off to Eastern Europe and dancing around someone's grave.
2. I fully understand them
Sagi   (09.26.11)
I also would not wish 30,000 shouting, yelling, screaming and dancing social misfits in my back yard.
3. There is a reason we left Ukraine by the Millions
Ber ,   Yahud   (09.26.11)
The Nazis weren't first, just the best anti-Semitism. The best part of all this anti-Semitism is that people have all kinds of negative assumptions about Judaism based on aspersion or other religions they have already encountered. The really know nothing of Judaism, which is a distinct entity. I do however believe that the pilgrims were disrespectful to the residents, Israelis and Jews in general are often rude, without need. But then I could say the same for Ukrainians in Israel.
4. Most of east block countries are antisemitic
Anna M Sedda ,   Rome-Italy   (09.26.11)
..for pure ignorance and communist propaganda,including Poland;for some reason the soviet and German occupation have let a mark in their mind until today.They where told day after day the "Jews are the problem" and they live with this lie until today....unfortunately The Palestinian are doing the same propaganda
5. Idiots...let them say they protest 'the occupation'
Daniel ,   Netherlands   (09.26.11)
And the world will cheer them. Don't these people have Jewish leftists European funded advisors?
6. Ukraine for Ukrainians? where is Jewish homeland?
observer ,   Egypt   (09.26.11)
so, Ashekanzi Jews are uprooted, they can't Return to their Khazar's homeland.
7. Oh, Khazaria Homeland tomorrow we'll be there
observer ,   Egypt   (09.26.11)
8. A little history lesson
Logic ,   Israel   (09.26.11)
These villagers should open a book before opening their big mouths. A little inconvenience is a small price to pay for their ancestors' behavior. According to the historical record, during the Khmelnytsky Uprising (1648–1657), over 100,000 Jews were mowed down by the Ukrainian Cossacks. During the post-1917 period of the Russian Civil War, 70,000 to 250,000 Jewish people were massacred by the Ukrainian forces led by Symon Petliura, 25% by the Ukrainian Green Army and various Ukrainian nationalist gangs. And as many of us know, there was collaboration between the Ukrainians and the Nazis during WWII, including their nationals taking part in Operation Reinhard to exterminate the Polish Jews. Many served at the extermination camps.
9. VERY Simple Solution...
Yonatan ,   Jerusalem   (09.26.11)
Move the Rebbe's kever to Eretz Yisrael. Then everybody who wants can visit his grave and no Jew will again have to travel to the stinking, rancid cesspit of Ukraine.
10. Uman Invasion
ShimonB ,   Kfar Saba   (09.26.11)
To be quite honest, I would complain too if 30,000 pilgrims descended on Kfar Saba to visit the grave of Navi Binyamin.
11. Ukrain makes serious $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
yoni ,   tel aviv   (09.26.11)
Many of the Breslovers have tried to bring rebbi nachmans body to Israel but the Ukrainians are making way too much cash to allow it to happen.
12. #9 you have just read my thoughts!
sasha ,   Bilbao, Basque   (09.26.11)
To be honest, for a simple ukranian antisemite, 30 thousand yidishe piraten with shtreimels and out of this world hats look provocating. The rabbi's kever should be moved to Sderot, near baba Salli.
13. The Ukranians make in two weeks their years budget
Yoav ,   Germany   (09.26.11)
In these alsmost two weeks, the city turn into Dollar zone. It start already in Airport of Borispol (oficial aitpor of ukrainian capital), the taxidrivers change their prices from grivna (ukr. currency) into dollar. To go from Borispol to Uman will cost you (last year) 300 (!!!) dollars. Then when you are in the city the prices for food are expolde. On the markt the "good people" of Ukraine demand for example for one egg 1 Dollar (the egg is not from gold.) for the flats the " good people" of Ukraine also claim astronomic summe of money from piligrims. In these two weeks the city make its a YEAR BUDGET (according to the mayor of this city. So on the one hand ukrainans hate Jews, on the other hand they love Jewish money. I personally would advice Jews to travell somewhere else, where they are welcome.
14. isn't it idolatry and blasphemy to warship graves
observer ,   Egypt   (09.26.11)
15. Simple answer - hold pork festival at the same time
Eric ,   Tel Aviv & NY   (09.26.11)
The government makes money on the annual pilgrimage while the locals suffer, so the locals should hold a pork festival at this time each year. When number of people making pilgrimage drops the national government will allow the body to be moved and everyone is happy.
16. idiots
Larry ,   Los Angeles   (09.26.11)
Don't the chassidim know that prayers are better from Eretz Yisroel? Why don't they bring the grave of Rabbi Nachman to Israel and stop giving money to the goyim that hate us.
17. #2 are you sure?
Israel Israeli ,   Tel Aviv   (09.26.11)
Those exact words were said in Hebron 1929, Berlin 1932, Uman 1941 and Yafo 1948. Are you sure you agree with them? I am sad to say that I am not surprised.
18. Money talks. Uman is a major $ source for Ukraine's economy
Tahl   (09.26.11)
And as such, they would never allow the security of this pilgrimage to be compromised by such protests. Do you honestly think they would give a sh*t if this antisemitic protest was anywhere else in Ukraine?
19. # 17 YES
Sagi   (09.26.11)
20. #4 Anna in Rome
Mark ,   Lodz, Poland   (09.26.11)
Regarding anti-Semitism in Poland, since you mentioned it and according to a recent survey...sorry, I forget which...runs at about 30% of the population. Chief Rabbi, Michael Schudrich has the best way of putting it... To Poles ...he says it's worse than you think... To Israelis and Jews who deem all Poles anti-Semitic... he tells them it's not as bad as you think. Last time 300 Alexandrow Chasidim came to Lodz for 3 days there was only one incident - one too much, mind - when a local yokel approached one of them and punched him. The 'tishes' were amazing - even for non-frum me.
21. Lo uman
jason white ,   afula, israel   (09.26.11)
What are they kvetching about? We have them the other 50 weeks.
22. #1, #9 No there is no simple solutuon
Yoav ,   Germany   (09.26.11)
#9 The ukranian authorities do not allow to bring his kever to Erez Israel. The reason is they make in these two week in Uman their YEAR BUDGET (according to the mayor). So no one would give up this golden source for this small city. #1 Absolutely agree dude, the normal people spent their holiday with families, but Hassids are not "normal", that is the problem;)
23. Israelis would bar Ukraine Christians
Dovid ,   Israel   (09.26.11)
If Ukrainian Christians wanted to make a pilgrimage every year, starting trouble in their towns, they'd ban them too. And I'm sure there would be a lot of anti-Christian statements (here in Israel we spit on priests, so that's nothing new). Israel for Israelis; Ukraine for Ukis. Works for me.
24. The problem with ukrainan is drink
Anna M Sedda ,   Rome-Italy   (09.26.11)
..and i am sure those where only a few drunk guys ...unfortunately like in Poland and all main eastern block youngsters,ukranians spend their time drinking... People that drink from day to night have dead brains...
25. #2 Sagi would you turn down $$millions
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (09.26.11)
If "misfits" paid you to allow them to dance around your back yard for a week? Well, you, probably would turn down $$millions just because you are such a hater, like these Ukranians, but normal people appreciate the revenue ESPECIALLY if they have NO OTHER INCOME the entire rest of the year.
26. #14---A little education goes far....
Ente Homar ,   Cairo, Illinois...US   (09.26.11)
Yala...Habibi...Going to the grave of a person known to be a Torah Scholar is not idol worship: No one prays to the dead person....Rather, we pray by the grave because the soul of the person was holy and worthy of carrying our prayers up to G-d. Incidentally, many Muslims in North Africa regularly pray by the graves of Jewish Tzaddikim.....is that Idol Worship?
27. wOrship
Boris ,   NYC, usa   (09.26.11)
Jews don't worship graves - Jews may pray at a place where a holy person was buried.
28. Stop this idol worshipping
CZO ,   NY, USA   (09.26.11)
The Uman pilgrimmage has a distinct flavor of another religion. This was always the danger of what Chassidism can lead to.
29. Why do Jews go there
k ,   US   (09.26.11)
why do Jews go in places they are not wanted, on top of that I am sure you give this town thousands and thousands of dollars in your tourist money These people are your enemy, many Ukrainians were more then happy to kill the Jews when the Nazis came by, they helped the Nazis with the Babi Yar massacre which was the real first genocide of the Jews
30. Mixed reaction
Yakov   (09.27.11)
I can definitely see where some here would not want to return to a country with such an anti-semitic past. But I can also see that many Ashakenazim have roots going back there, so they may not just be going there for pilgrimage, but also to reconnect with that past. I cannot really blame them for wanting to do two things at once on a trip like that. It is up to each and every one of those persons to decide what that country and its history means to them. It's not like they will be returning there to live again. Now, as for where I would rather be, I'd rather be in Israel than Ukraine on any day of the week!
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