Search YouTube for some riots in 100 Sheaarim - and watch these weasels in action. Once you find out what flips their lid - you are ready for combat.

... you cannot make your service in the army conditional on special requests. It's the army. You can't even do that in summer camp!

As a haredi woman who has been a professional in the U.S. for over 20 years I have noticed a change in corporate behavior. I attended a class in "Global Diversity" given by the corporation where I work. It is no longer appropriate for a man to shake hands with a woman unless she offers her hand first (Thank you, Muslims!) I also have never had a problem working out a schedule for Shabbat and Yom Tov. This is at a major U.S. corporation which used to be known for anti-Semitism many years ago. BTW they even do business in Israel.

Well in an army EVERYBODY has to adapt to the needs of the army. Why the haredim think this rule dosnt apply to them? Every soldier has to sacrify this freedom for the army, now tell me why just the haredim/religious people should be the exeption from the rule? Are they better as the seculars? No, they arnt! And btw, show the numbers of the secular peopl who work, Im sure the 61% will get beaten easyly.

legal killing machine. Its there to kill the enemy. It is not there to effect social change and social engineering.It is not in the promotion business. It is in the killing business. Get rid of the stupid draft. It is spliting the country needlessly. Effect a professional paid army whose job 1 will be to protect the country and to throttle the enemy.

NO match made in heaven here! Army unsuitable for haredim haredim unsuitable for Army haredim unsuitable for haredim for just a few hundred shekels the unsuitable haredim should be able to buy themselves a FREE PASS from the IDF but must WORK (horrors of horrors) for the state an equivalent time...that money "earned" could be applied to the BUY OUT...if not, cleaning jail cells is a good alternative...

The army's job is to protect this country, its' citizens and its' institutions. This means regimentation and structure. It means, also, that separation of secular and religious cannot exist. All soldiers are equal in the eyes of the IDF. Don't bother questioning the logic of this, as the success is in our very existence. If you are protected by the IDF, you can serve! This is also consistent with Jewish law, health and survival supersede all laws, customs and requirements.

I have asked multiple times, and still can not get a good answer where it is written as a law, not a custom or an interpretation, that men mus be separate from women and can not hear them sing. The idea that this is based on treating the women like "Queens" is just plain silly, you would be obligated to listen to a Queen.

Compromise is necessary to make any group of people workable. That means demands need to be negotiated in good faith by both sides, and then honored. Grievances should be made and addressed honestly. In the 'real world', compromises have to be made. As for "support" of "students", again: Definitions have to be negotiated and compromise must happen. It would be a tragedy to marginalize and isolate any group. Face it: There aren't that many Jews in the world. If the cadet class is 70% religious, maybe the secular people need to find out what they're doing right to get there, and apply it to others. It isn't necessarily a matter of religiosity. It might be as simple as 'determination' and education.

You are not kravi so you have no right to weigh in with your opinion. The army asks kravi soldiers to give their lives in impossible conditions. The soldiers can make many special requests, and one is respect. No one will draft Bedouin or Druze women or demand that Muslim soldiers eat in cantines where pork is served, out of respect for their culture. Barbivai and the idiot Bahad 1 officer decide to publicly humiliate the kravi soldiers for no reason. The army could have and should have immediately dismissed the officer and Barbivai because their job is not social engineering or Jew-baiting, their job is to prepare these young men to die for you. If the army humiliates and treats them like garbage, why should they do anything for the army and for you? You want low-moral conscripts to defend you? You saw how well the Arab armies did against the IDF.

believe Allah commands them to destroy Israel and eventually all Infidels. Therefore, Allah commands them to do whatever it takes to accomplish this command. The words and deeds of men are meaningless to the Ayatollahs if they countermands the words and wishes of Allah. As with Hitler and the Nazis, the only way to ride the world of this diseased thinking Is to crush it completely. Failure to do so, dooms the world to nuclear blackmail and worse for decades to come.

Ie they left the camp and went to sing and dance elsewhere, away from the men. Just one of many examples. The fact that you have asked but not received an answer does not mean the answers are not there, just that you haven't really asked with any great seriousness.

You wanna compromise with relgious fanatics, go make a compromise with Iran. You think there aren't enough Jews to defend Israel, get over here and/or send your children. There is no reason why women soldiers should be made into second class citizens for the sake of some boys who can't keep it down when they hear her sing. We may be the "chosen people" but these boys are not the Master Race! They must not be given extra privileges1 As many have said, IT IS AN ARMY!!!!

Well, I dont see how a compromise could work, cos all such compromises would disadvantage the not haredi soldiers and thats not fair! How you wanna tell women living in a democracy that they have to accept misogyny? Thats impossible and against any law!

"Yet if a religious student at a Kolel is considered a student who does not work, why is a university researcher considered a worker? " do i have to explain that to you ? seriously ? really?

Its the other way around, haredim are unsuitable for the army, and I say that as a former IDF reservist. Actually, haredim aren't suitable for Israel either.

The majority of the attitudes espress here is why True Redemption not come soon and we stay in galus! Most of you are full of ill feelings.

that the only way to fix it is for the Moshiach to come. Nobody here will listen to anybody else. We are really a complete mess.

Eric, Jewish law -- Torah -- is much more than Chumash and 10 commandments (which you seem to be unaware is part of Chumash). Numerous books have been written on the Torah's laws of modesty and of interaction between the sexes. Your response is to say that it does not matter unless you can find it in so many words in the Aseret Ha'dibrot -- or at least somewhere in Bereshit, Shmot, Vayikra, Bemidbar or Dvarim. There's much more to Torah than that, my friend, and anyone who dismisses that fact is not interested in what Torah has to say.

"Such arguments usually do not offer facts. There is no mention, for example, that some 61% of haredim work, according to the Central Bureau of Statistics." The fact that 61% of WOMEN mostly working part time at low labor jobs on behalf of a family of 8, 10, 12, 14 people does not cut it. BOTH parents need FULL TIME occupations if they are going to breed like cats. Take away the support from, YES the backs of seculars, and WATCH Haredi families shrink.

For all those saying, an army's job is to protect the people, then why is it so important for a religious soldier to hear a woman singing? Is this going to improve Israel's security or did kicking four of the bravest, most determined cadets in the IDF out of an officer's course (to "put them in their place") improve Israel's security? BTW, even in the American Army religious needs need to be met (no matter how inconvenient). I have a friend who was in Iraq during Pesach and he was provided with Matza and kosher for Pesach food/wine for ALL of Pesach. This was in the American army!!!!

It would be physically impossible for Israel to end the national service in favor of a standing army because of population size. The total population is about 7.5 million and you break that down 1) Children 2) The elderly 3) Those physically unable to serve 4) The arabs 5) The haredi So remove all that lot lets say you got around 2 million eligible to serve. Then from that 2 million it comes down to who wants to serve. The IDF is currently made up of the reserves and a full time army and there are only about 15,000 individuals in the regulars. What reason is there to assume that will grow substantially if we get rid of the reserves? Not much point buying the equipment you need in the quantities you need if you want to win a war if you don't have the manpower to operate it?

come join us. love, su [haredi hard working-and omg-also a woman!]

have been derailed in Israel for some time now. Society is torn apart by sectarianism, racism, venom and hatred. The ultra religious are masters at stirring up trouble by provocation and then blaming the seculars for their perfectly natural reaction. No real and genuine attempt has ever been made to incorporate the Arab communities into our society. Ethiopeans are frowned upon and barraged with racist slurs. Our politicians, in general, are despised by the electorate, they are aware of this, but not only will do nothing about it, rather they have every intention of perpetuating our outdated and immoral electoral system which keeps them in easy street and us in derision. The end is nigh, one way or another, things will change, either the whole system changes for the benefit of society or society,ours, goes down the tube.

About why is it important, and the women's singing. The issue is discipline, and accepting orders. A soldier MUST obey military discipline. The haredi soldiers agree to obey orders so long as they do not find them irksome. This is a real problem. In the article: "How could it be that the same soldier who does not wish to hear female singing has become the one who forces itself upon the others? After all, it’s the others who force these rules upon such soldier." Yes, they - the army - does enforce rules. The whole point about being a soldier, is that you have to obey orders. Attending regimental parades where anthems are sung is just one example. It is minor but it is telling. They must attend, they must not protest, and if they disobey orders they must be brutally punished. This is army life. This is needed for war.

in Europe over the centuries these people made a living as small time money lenders. Modernity has destroyed that way of life, but the culture of not doing hard work for a living remains. The drastic solution of removing welfare benefits will lead them into more crime and fraud as a way to survive. The only solution is to totally break up their society by force. This means using force to change their dress code for a start. Removing the uniform is the first step in forcing them to assimilate. It may sound harsh but if it isn't done there is no future for Israel as a modern western state. In the past such groups were expelled from the country. In Israel's case its more likely that the rest of society will emigrate instead.

haredim unsuitable with Israel. cancel their funding!