Jewish Scene
Ex-haredim to sue State for damages
Kobi Nahshoni
Published: 03.02.12, 09:39
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1. there is no end to their schemes !
good grief these people have found another way to extract money from us. No No No... tell them to sue their own leaders. I swear these leeches cannot be satisfied until we are all sucked dry.
2. Common sense.
Sue the morons that taught you, not the state.
3. Tora and Science in State schools...
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (02.03.12)
will solve the main problems in Israel and contribute to being AM EHAD.
4. Haredim and schools
Ed Codish ,   Pardessiya   (02.03.12)
I assume that there was a secular or dati-leumi school in the area. If so, the ex-students should sue their parents for not enrolling them. The State, of course, should not permit schools that do not educate to exist.
5. Sue your own parents and leaders!
Jew1 ,   Ashdod   (02.03.12)
As it is both of them have sucked blood and money out of this very nation they claim as god given. Rabbies have used all of you to keep uneducated so that tomorrow you all will not open your mind. Proper education will help everyone to land a proper job, and proper job will allow haredim to get mixed up with normal people and that will be eye opener to atleast few to them. Rabbies can not take such a risk of loosing their chair and power. The whole haredi community - instead of believing in god; is believing in Rabbi and taking it's advise for every small matter. The haredi community = ideal worsshiping community. The real followers of god is a masorti community who also believes in god but also stays in present 21st centuary and do not try to pull the whole jewish land back to stone age.
6. Hilarios..The state is responsible for them being stupid
Al   (02.03.12)
You cant make this stuff up. Entitlement knows no bounds in schnorrer filled Israel. Hey dummies...tale it up with your parents , they send you there. Bloody morons...geez.
7. I strongly suggest
Sagi   (02.03.12)
that they sue the State for the deep psychological damage they have suffered. In my opinion the State is fully responsible for this by permitting, under law, that they should have existed in such a manner and in such an environment. I am most serious in what I say, I have deep sympathy for these unfortunate people, this is not an attempt at cynicism.
8. Those ex are becoming "MENSCHEN"
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (02.03.12)
They have lost years to "study" unnecessary subjects . Children in State schools don't need to learn tora , Jewish History yes .
Fenster ,   USA   (02.03.12)
I think this is excellent. The way you force the government to act is to sue it. The government is responsible for educating all citizens, including the haredim. If it fails to do so and a court finds it liable, this could force the government to DO SOMETHING. If the government doesn't want to keep paying claims, it will have to start educating everyone, even if that means picking a fight with parents and rabbis who don't want to educate their kids. I see some commenters upset that people who never learned math and science are getting paid for their failure. I understand that. But the big picture is more important. Lawsuits like this one may ultimately force the government and the haredi schools to start teaching the core curriculum.
10. Tinokot shenishbu (brain washed children)
J.K. ,   Brooklyn USA   (02.03.12)
11. Blame the others, huh?
Anna Giladi ,   Haifa, Israel   (02.03.12)
Who forced them to be haredi, and why, once they no longer had to obey their parents, didn't they just go secular? WHO made them study limited BS in the first place? Religion is an overrated hobby, a matter of choice and at worst, peer pressure, so they may want to pay for the correction of their own mistakes themselves.
12. Sagi
There is a danger here that their leaders will latch on to this as a new scheme to make money. These people have always been accused of forming a state within a state and demanding and receiving special exemptions from the rules which govern everybody else in society. If you allow a precedent for making the state liable for damages arising from that special treatment you open the door to every sort of thing. For example if a state allowed Jewish exemption from a law against circumcision then the state one could be held liable for damages caused by circumcision. The principle cfould be applied everywhere. The state is not liable. The liable body is the body which demanded and received its own jurisdiction inside the state. The thing to do about this is to disband the state within the state. One country, one people, one law for all.
13. # 11 Who is to blame,see # 10
J.K. ,   Brooklyn USA   (02.03.12)
when those x haredis saw the light,they were already in the late teens or early twenties,quite late to cach up with the secular world,in education and other things,its very hard to break away from parents,family,friends,to lose what you have,and not to be sure that you will be able to reach the promised land,with the tools you possess,but what those young people are doing may have an effect on haredi parents and rabbis,not politicians,who are the cause of the problem.
14. # 3 ORA ! Tora and Science
J.K. ,   Brooklyn USA   (02.03.12)
The polititcians from Shas and Agudah,will never permit that to happen,ignorance of their flocks is their bread and butter.
15. A good strategy.
Rachel ,   USA   (02.03.12)
If nothing else will force the State to make sure that all children get an education, the threat of paying millions of shekels may get their attention. There is nothing in Gemara forbidding learning math, English or technology. It specifically says that he who doesn't teach his son a trade is teaching him to be a thief. Let's see the State enforce its own laws so we here in the US don't have to see fathers pathetically begging for money to marry their children off because they have no parnassah in Israel.
16. Anna , their parents forced them !
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (02.04.12)
the parents choose the "school" for their children . When leaving their parents way of "life" they are often rejected , sometimes those parents even sit "shiva" .
17. amazing twisted minds
robert ,   TelAviv   (02.03.12)
the Haredim refuse to teach certain subjects, refuse to live like 20th cent people- and then sue the government for not teaching them?. Well duuuh- what it is they want, free lunch? They already have that...what will they come up next?
18. 26 and two daughters
Michael Geizhals ,   Haifa, Israel   (02.04.12)
We should pay them immediately after all we will give them whatevei they want it the end. Plus compensation for not being eligble for soilders pay and grantbecause there lifestyle didn't allow them to go to the army. Plus further compensation for not being taught birth control or family planning. Plus further compensation for not being taught any skills.and compensation for the income lost by getting jobs and not staying in Yesivah.
19. They sue the State
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (02.04.12)
Because the State allows such schools and subsidise them . Those who sue, LEFT the charidi world , and suffer because of the State's incapacity to force ALL schools to teach basic needed material . But this is too difficult to understand for some here i think
20. to 6 , al
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (02.04.12)
Many of those who leave the charidi world are thereafter REJECTED by their parents , relatives and friends . Some parents sit even shiva for this son . And regarding morons , look at yourself , dummie !
21. sue
nossen tzvi ,   J-M   (02.04.12)
The Amish people in America have a great system. They allow their young to have a year off to do whatever they want. Then the youth have to decide whether they are in or out. If in, they get baptized and join the plain folk. The Amish fled to the new world because they were anabaptists who gave their children a choice and did not baptise them in infancy. Obviously the haredim are not pro-choice.
22. access courses
tsfatisha ,   tsfat   (02.04.12)
colleges could offer a year/two year access courses which would give a bagrut equivalence at the end of the course and guarantee admittance to certain university courses at the end of it. such access courses are very popular and successful in the uk. they are specifically designed to give people who failed in school or otherwise missed out on a high school education a way back into higher education. they usually offer a science or an arts track and give the students the essentials that they missed out on in school. combined with study skills and other support the students are able to enter university if they wish. if the government gave these ex haredi students a year or two's tuition and living expenses grant so they could take such an access course it would enable these people to fully integrate and contribute to mainstream society. where there's a will there's a way. since most people who study torah have a good grasp of logic and have good memories and other study abilities an access course should give them all they need. i know a haredi man who taught himself computer programming during his visits to the toilet and he now works in a good online job in the evenings as well as continuing to learn/teach in a haredi kollel. and that was without going to any kind of access course. so people can catch up - it just needs a few colleges to offer these types of courses. i'm sure there are a lot of secular people who messed up in high school and didn't get bagrut who could benefit too!
23. Constructive Solution
rivkah f. ,   jerusalem   (02.04.12)
The state should pay for crash courses in English, math, Hebrew, composition, and general knowledge for these people. It is wrong to ask for money but the missing education is what they need. It isn't the government's fault andt just as new immigrants receive ulpan instruction in Hebrew, the haredim who want to work with the general public should get that basic education. If they do, Israel will benefit greatly.
24. 14JK Try II That s a dream...
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (02.04.12)
But as Herzl said it: If you will it it s no dream.
25. # 24 ORA ,is it the will of politicians ?.
J.K. ,   Brooklyn USA   (02.04.12)
left,right,center,the holiest thing in Israel is the coalition,no matter who the prime Minister is,aguda,shas, are in the coalitian and in control.
26. The should be suing their yeshivas
DR ,   nyc   (02.05.12)
Yes, the state shares in this too, but the ultimate responsibility for their education is the school / yeshiva they attended. If those schools did their jobs, these ex hareidi's wouldn't have a problem!
27. 25 It is the will of the citizens...
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (02.05.12)
28. This has nothing to do with the State
Netanya ,   Netanya   (02.05.12)
I am an English teacher and where I live many children, who are not haredim attend religious schools, where English is also not taught or started at such a late age and not made a priority. The females are completely lacking even basic English and the males are not close to any level as in the non-religious schools, however the parents know this and choose for this type of education. If the parents cared and wanted the schools to change the priorities, it would be done, but that is not what the parents want. Stop blaming the state for the problems from your parents, blame them. They sent you to these schools and they didn't want core studies. Just think of all the protests and violence which would come about if the State actually required subjects which the religious don't want. You can't have your cake and eat it to. Get real! Put the blame where do, not on the State. Will these same people suing the state also give some of that money back to the state for not doing their army service and the free ride they have taken their entire lives up till their leaving the cult?
29. TO ORA #3 State religious schools havd Torah and Science
Andi ,   Israel   (02.05.12)
This article is about Haredi education. The state Religious Zionist schools do teach Torah and secular subjects together. That explains why there are so many educated -doctors, lawyers, academics, senior army officers, hi-tech workers etc etc- who are from this sector
30. Sagi makes a good point. Maybe the
RobertHaymond ,   Israel/Canada   (02.05.12)
state will wake up in the face of such lawsuits and force the Charedim to comply with the school acts. So far, the state has been negligent by not insisting on compliance!
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