Jewish Scene
'Israelis should stand up to haredim'
Itamar Eichner
Published: 17.02.12, 16:14
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1. Israelies are black or white
moti ,   rbs   (02.17.12)
israelies are religious or not religious they are not interested in water down BS... either they are Religious/Masorati or not religious at all.... the Reform/Conservative movement doesn't work here because there is no interested in it... even not
2. This woman is as treif as they come...
Arthur ,   SF, CA   (02.17.12)
3. Conservatives are a fringe minority in Israel
Kyle ,   Southpark, CO, USA   (02.17.12)
If they don't like it, then make aliyah en masse. What they really want is for the "Orthodox monopoly" to be turned over to them first, before even considering aliyah, even though their presence in Israel is minuscule. If "no government funding" is the reason they are failing in Israel, how do they explain Conservative "success" in the USA (if they even are successful, their numbers are actually shrinking), congregations in the U.S. do not receive any government funding.
4. #1, You missed her point
mea   (02.17.12)
I believe one of her key points was that there has been an expression of interest in Israel for opportunities to explore Conservativism. I agree with you that Israelis view it as all or nothing at all, but I do know people who would like to touch the tradition. The beauty of Reform and Conservative movements is that it allows a person to explore aspects of religion without having fanatics trying to indoctrinate and control of your entire life. It is understandable when someone avoids the entire subject if that is the only choice. Still, the very reason these practices thrive in America is because people do not feel they have to swop out their entire lifestyle just to fulfill some curiosity that may or may not develop into something deeper. For women, these movements allow us to step out of the nursery and kitchen and actually be recognized as something more than baby machines and workhorses. To me it is amazing that $600 million dollars a year is given to one sector of a democratic society simply because they do not value work. When in the early history of Judaism did men sit in tents and study all day while the women tended the herds and hunted? When did women's voices and faces become abhorrent? Was that right after the Song of the Sea?
5. Orthodoxy has no future. Rabanit is correct.
Michael ,   California, USA   (02.17.12)
Israelis need to take a stand up and support secular or Reform Judaism. Even better, support Cultural Jews, which is what I do, but it's a small organized movement so far, a hiloni movement. Most Israelis are wishy washy, which means they don't care to take a stand. This isn't good because Orthodoxy exploits it to give Israel its negative image.
6. "rabbi"
Yisrael ,   boston   (02.17.12)
I'm orthodox & live near a Conservative "rabbi" & each shabbat I walk to and from shul only to see this "rabbi" sit in his house watching TV on a huge screen TV ,, he doesn't even bother to close his curtains , he has no shame in desecration of shabbat ,so why bother with frum jews
7. Judaism
dov epstein ,   efrat, israel   (02.17.12)
Live here, and you can criticize.She said""Judaism flourished for hundreds of years because it allowed people to express themselves in the way they felt it appropriate." NO, it flourished because we guarded the torah from outside jewish thought. We didn't assimilate, and eat salads at treif restuarants, or play guitars at shabbat servics. yep, the extremists should not be heard, but she is also extreme because she accepts a diluted Torah. Watch how her diluted jewish family disintegrates, one, none and gay parented families, with warped Jewish practices.
8. You are truly Jewish if...
manicdrummer ,   Galilee, Israel   (02.17.12)
You keep kosher, observe the Sabbath, study Torah and obey the Commandments. All Diaspora Jews should move to Israel soon. Don't be left behind. The Lord is about to do our bidding.
9. sorry Julie
miketaylor ,   us   (02.17.12)
just because you call yourself a "rabbi" doesn't mean you are, last time I checked there's no such thing as a female rabbi. people in Israel want the real thing, not some fake watered down garbage
10. Conservative Lady Rabbi
Hesh ,   nyc usa   (02.17.12)
Move to Israel,stop whining from the comfort of your home in the states.
11. Judaidm is black or white...
Edithann ,   USA   (02.17.12)
Don't you realize Torah has always been a declaration of war on all 'others'...and now because Israel is a microcosm of concentrated Judaism gone wild...it's declared war on you too... TATA
12. What is wrong with everyone? Dialogue is needed, not this.
Henry from New York ,   USA   (02.17.12)
Everyone seems to be wishing for a fight between Kharedim and everyone else in Israel. In a time when there's a stable Middle East, maybe this wouldn't be as dangerous (though it still wouldn't be right). However, when you have a likely war on the horizon, the last thing you need is a civil war. Stop the violent rhetoric and make a real effort to have dialogue and agreement. Make sure people have an Israel to visit and not a Palestine where the Jews have been pushed into the sea because they were too busy squabbling amongst themselves. It destroyed the Hasmonaean Kingdom and it can do the same to Medinat Yisrael.
13. Hihihihi
Ariel Ben Yochanan ,   Kfar Tapuah, Efraim   (02.17.12)
B"H - Ynet: "Julie Schonfeld, highest ranking female rabbi in the US.." - ABY: Just because some one holds an opinion it doesn't mean it is legitimate or right.
14. It's the politics and demography
a secular Israeli   (02.17.12)
As a secular Jerusalemite woman my answer is that we are very aware and worried and protest against the religious coercion of the Haredim. There are 2 problems though: 1. Every political party sells us and our interests for the Haredim in order to form a coalition, and the high birthrate of the Haredim makes them more and more influential in the Israeli society.
15. Conservative hobwash
Sara ,   Ashdod israel   (02.17.12)
Look lady. The fact that you may be very popular in the us and a newsweek "star" dors not mean u have the right to slander orthodox jews! Haredim do not control or coerce the jews in israel...they go by the book...whereas conservative or reform jrws have changed the religion to suit their lives...judiasm is not a democracy or something that can be altered...and saying that the govt funds the haredim...well should we dip into your funds?..and how thry are acquired...how expensive conservtive and reform schools are and membership to your synagogues are?...so if the money comes to your assosiations than its for a good cause? Distortion of true Torah laws inorder to gratify your "soul"...more like your ego, dear...so sad u need to use the only loyal population G-d has left as a stage to get more famous...
16. Lapid is right
grandma ,   USA   (02.17.12)
Lapid just said more or less the same - between the haredim and the arabs - will soon outnumber the tax-paying, IDF-serving Israelis, who have been allowing their tax funds to be spent on orthodox schools, stipends, etc. all out of proportion to their numbers. When will the majority of Israelis wake up to the fact that this corruption will force the state into bankruptcy or chaos? Time for the majority (secular and modern orthodox) to regain control of the government and government spending priorities.
17. i stop reading since "female rabbi" lol
ester   (02.17.12)
18. Religion in america is a business ..it has nothing to do
Al   (02.17.12)
with anything but business. With 500 channels on TV, endless porn sites on the internet and a host of other diversions, religion is one of those diversions. In effect everyone is trying to garb your eyeballs inorder to sell you something. Chabad, the conservatives, the reform, and the others that have come from America all peddle that special elixer that will 'furfill' your lives and give you 'salvation'. Heres the deaL. Judaisim is one tough religion for a very tough people. We are a stiff necked people who have always survived because we stuck to our guns. Dont allow the Americanization of our religion to take hold in Israel. Its enough you have the GAP as well as Mcdonalds and we all know what crap they sell.
19. Why dont you open your eyes
J K ,   the rova   (02.17.12)
Hows about you actually go to the Hareidi neighborhoods and realize that there is a very small group of extremists, who are acting out of line. Most Hareidim are the nicest of people, with the highest degree of manners and they should not be vilified for strictly adhering to our ancient traditions. Torah Judaism is the way to go. And, Madam Executive Vice President, since your movement has given up on working within the confines of Torah, your movement has been dying a quick death and Torah Judaism is flourishing. So, while I firmly agree that the actions of a small minority are not at all acceptable, to come out and make the generalizations which you are, is out of line,
20. #14 Secular, Correct u r, but what will you do about it?
Michael ,   California, USA   (02.17.12)
You know that you support the system by paying taxes. You cannot say it is not your fault that Orthodoxy thrives in Israel. If you are serious, fight it or do what I did. They will not survive if we don't pay. Civil war is the other option.
21. orthodox
peretz ,   New York City   (02.17.12)
umm wait whose the movement which is suffering from 70% assimilation-orthodox or reform? yeah we "orthodox" or Jews, have manged to out-weather the karaties and the other heretics and we will continue to follow Hashem's Torah(which you have since stopped) when your children convert to christianity.
22. AMEN
peretz ,   New York City   (02.17.12)
she is such a fool, my dog knows more torah than that heretic does
23. to #5 Michael, the "Cultural" Jew
Moishe ,   Golutsk   (02.17.12)
What is your definition of Jewish culture? Gifelte fish and matzo balls? May be CD collection of Barbara Straizant? I can tell you with certainly that at least four generations of children of these Orthodox will be called Jewish. I doubt children of "Cultural" Jews like yourself or of this so called "rabbi" will be Jewish in the generations to come.
24. JTS, Conservative Movement Should Be ASHAMED!
TLF ,   New York, USA   (02.17.12)
Her divisive comments disgust me. The Conservative movement is dying in the US because it has nothing to offer its members than the anti-orthodox comments from its leaders to its aging congregations. Hence aging and shrinking congregations, closing day schools, empty seats every day except Yom Kippur. I grew up in a NY suburban conservative congregation and now can't stomach the divisive, anti-Orthodox Shabbos sermons in Conservative shuls. Truly hateful. Given our small numbers and the serious, sometimes deadly threats against us throughout almost the entire world, why does the Conservative movement to this? It's not just this woman, it's the entire movement. But JTS and Conservative leaders will do NOTHING to stop it. And particularly in Israel, where Israelis shun the Masorti movement, you see the open hostility and acts of provocation, with no thought to the consequences for Jewish unity or how the non-Jewish world perceives such attacks. For shame!!!!
25. A female rabbi
Doug ,   US   (02.17.12)
Is she a lesbian? If not, then she isn't "kosher l'mehadrin".
26. Feminist Rabbi rant at Charedis
deborah Lurya ,   Irvine   (02.17.12)
I truly take offense Rabbi, at your attack on the Haredi in a flagrant attempt to cause division within the Jewish people at a dangerous historical time when we , world Jewry, are in an existential crises. No Rabbi, the Israelis dont need to stand up to the Charedi, they need to stand up to the left and hold them accountable for their crimes- because of Rabin and his cohorts, 2,000 Jews have died, and thousands injured thanks to the setting up of a PLO state in our midst. The leftists, Labor, Kadima, Meretz- these are the enemies, they live in our communities. They will happily sell out their neighbors in Judea and Samaria and E. Jerusalem for a bowl of soup, or a promise of peace. Oslo opened the door for nothing but war, and more war. Yeah- right, peace is for the other guy, not us, ask those who wrote the Hamas Charter and Fatah's charter. Wake up Rabbi, Israel is surrounded by its blood enemies, and it is people like you that are making things worse, not better.
27. I agree to only one thing.....
Israeli 2   (02.17.12)
Especially the Charedim should be the bastion to "derech ertz." and be the most staunch defenders of women and children.....yet.....regretfully....they do the opposite in this regard. All the rest is hogwash. NOTE to all talkbackers: Women are not barred from putting on Tefillin or Talit.
28. not religious
agy ,   lv, usa   (02.17.12)
the educated israelis don't care about rabanut nor recognize it. Israel is a secular country and the gov. should stop the welfare for haredim.
29. Yes! Finally someone is saying the truth out loud!
Anna Asher ,   NY,NY   (02.17.12)
No one in the US is trying to keep Haredim from practicing Judaism in their way. But when they spit on little girls, shove all women to the back of the bus, and prevent women from worshipping at national sites, then they are trampling on the rights of all of us. we need to make sure our money and support go to non-sexist, democratic movements in Israel.
30. To Be or not To Be a real Jew. That is the question
Yossi   (02.17.12)
To # 15 Sara, Judaism is not a democracy and cannot be altered. ??Gee!, just like the koran's scriptures. Sex Segregation, brainwashing children, rioting, attacking children, spitting, vandalizing stores, making schmattas out of women, just like your islamic cousins. You'll make allah very proud; the only item missing is the 'pillori'.-- And to you # 8, manicdrumer; the lord is about to do his bidding?, Please let me have his e.mail address so I can enquire the approximate timing of this bidding. Thanks.
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