Opinion
Time to tell our story
Boris Dolin
Published: 26.03.12, 17:55
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62 Talkbacks for this article
31. @23......
Dan ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
Obviously you have a different interpretation of Zionism than I, but I could also find countless cases of "non-Zionist" behavior on the left.
32. To nr 25
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
I'm sorry to say this to you, but we can't end the "occupation" because we are not occupying anyone, and if you have bothered to read my talkbacks it is indeed mind boggling how you can insist on repeating the word occupation over and over again. What is also mind boggling is that Israel is one of the smallest countries on earth, half the size of Denmark, constantly under existential threats but always extending a hand of peace to its Arab neighbors, and on the other hand 22 Arab states, Turkey and Iran that show no interest in coexistence whatsoever - rather showing contempt for who and what we are and seeking our death and destruction. The Arab world consisting of more than 20 states is 1.5 times bigger than USA. How this is a conflict about land is beyond me. Moslem and Arab anti-Semitism has existed for 1400 years. Arab and Moslem aggression, wars of aggression, hatred for Jews and hostility to Israel indeed existed before that fateful year of 1967 - the year when the so called "occupation" began. What should be done is for UK to accept responsibility for the historical and political instability in the Middle East due to artifical borders made by the UK and the abandonment by the British, of the reestablishment of the Jewish state - and this abandonment was and is illegal and goes against the San Remo treaty of 1920 which said that Cis-Jordan (Israel, Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria, Gaza and Golan), Trans-Jordan and southern Lebanon up until the bend of the Litani River was the officially designated territory to the reestablished Jewish nation state in the ancestral Jewish homeland by the San Remo treaty of 1920. What would also be a good start is for the Moslem world to accept our rightful place in Israel and our equal human, civil and national rights among the nations. And that is hardly any war mongering my friend.
33. To nr 23 Our declaration of independence does not...
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
..regard Judea, Samaria, Gaza and Jerusalem to be "occupied". Our declaration of independence on the contrary admits our ancient historical bonds to the land of Israel and supports equal rights for all citizens. I am all for that. What I think most of us "right wingers" oppose is the vile, deceitful and insincere and deliberate mix up between equal civil rights for all and "shared national rights to the same land". They are not the same. While there are dozens of nation states across Europe that have their ethnic and national identities cemented firmly in their constitutions, legal system and in the minds of the people, foreigners and ethnic minorities can indeed live among the majority of the host nation - accepting that they live there because the host nation has granted them equal rights and equal freedom - not an invitation to create a state within the state, to drive out the owners of the land or to replace one civilization with another civilization in the name of "democracy". Most of our brothers and sisters in Judea and Samaria are Zionists. Those who aren't have no business in our land. As for detente with our Arab neighbors, that cannot be made on the expense of our national security, our territory, land, borders, defensible borders, demographic majority or indeed our history and origins. A detente is predicated on mutual agreements but the Arabs won't accept us. Instead of lashing out at our countrymen I suggest you lash out at the Arab states who prevent peace by denying us Jews the national freedom that we have yearned for for the past 2000 years.
34. To nr 21
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
Dear Sara, I am more than happy to conduct a reasonable and interesting dialogue and conversation with you but please do so in understandable English. As far as the Internet is concerned, it consists of software and of hardware - physical computers all over the world, and much of the hardware and software is Israeli. The existence of the computer is due to the Hungarian Jew John Von Neumann - without whom there would probably be no computers in existence today. To use the very technology that Jews invented against the Jews themselves is indeed pathetic and that is what I emphatically tried to explain to dear split from the US.
35. To nr 20 Seek facts and truth - not blind anti-Israel...
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
...ideology. Quite frankly sir, you have no clue what you are talking about and that's probably why you have limited yourself to a one sentence talkback, because the enemies of Israel cannot and will not stand up to facts and truth and cannot and will not respond to factual and truthful commens defending our national rights to our ancient homeland to live as a free and independent people. We are not doing this on anyone's expense - it has been our land for the past 4000 years. We are not seeking control over others but merely seek to control our own destiny. It is your ideological hostility to that and your blindness to facts that make me question your true motives. If you doubt the level of sincerity and truthfulness of our national cause it would be great to hear your concerns about why you are against Israel and support the Arabs, but that would require some contents and factual background in your reasoning rather than one sentence hate talkbacks. The reason why the world doesn't believe the Israeli side of the conflict is because the Israeli side is always silenced, intimidated and threatened and outnumbered by hateful Moslems and Left leaning Westerners. If many in the world will let Israel speak, then just maybe will the world hear the truth for once.
36. #29 Robert
(03.27.12)
I'm sorry but I don't understand your point. I agree that all Jews are genetically related. They are also more closely related to Arabs more than to Europeans. I'm suggesting Israel should be emphasizing what is has in common with Arabs...not what it has in common with European societies. .
37. We are fighting the wrong things
Yael Schlichting ,   Kiryat Motzkin   (03.27.12)
Defense on the field is different from defense in the newsrooms! We must sue the Arabs on a western court, whenever they tell a lie! We must try to gain control over their financial resources! There are so many Arab NGOs in Europe and the US that you cannot count them and they are busy in spreading the lie! We cannot just watch them and later say, "Oh, this wasn't true and this and this....." The public will not remember and in the meantime, the damage already is done! We must drown these liars in lawsuits! Western states give us the opportunity to do so, so we must use it!
38. an Israeli 'state of mind......
tiki ,   belgium   (03.27.12)
The Israeli state of mind is: DEFENCE, when it should be OFFENCE........,TAKE charge! The Israeli State of mind is: RE-act, not act-FIRST! The Israeli state of mind is: trying to CONVINCE the inconvincables! Live up to the name the hating, Anti semitic hypocrites of the world gave you, you can't change it anyway. You can't MAKE them love you! Why not? Your Jews! When you AGREE with everything the haters say, there's NO argument! NO argument? NO media attention (not interesting enough, doesn't sell). Better be hated & feared, than loved & pitied, or worse, like the situation is today....NOT loved & NOT pitied! STOP trying to be Mr. Niceguy, it won't work! First step......'change the name of the Israeli DEFENCE army, into the Israeli Army! That's more than enough. Step two: STOP talking/explaining, just DO what must be done. The poisenous MEDIA won't like that, but who cares? Step three: STOP the hating world from putting you into a Getto or make you 'run in defence again! ISRAEL has become the synonym of the JEW. ****The world has recognized Israel's 'achilles heel....., wanting to be LOVED, and it won't let that happen under NO condition****
39. #10 split
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.27.12)
It’s you, who doesn’t get it, as usual. If you want to witness what’s going on you have to open your eyes first; it’s the Jews that are being demonized. And you are one of those doing the demonizing.
40. to 34
21   (03.27.12)
sorry iam not good in english but realy i am good in understanding i think it is enough for me ..so i use the net to understand it is enough and can say what i want in my mother language -the arabic ,
41. it’s the Jews that are being demonized
split ,   US   (03.27.12)
Try to distinct a demonisation from rightful critique ,...
42. To nr 41 - Can you improve this world by hating an entire..
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.27.12)
nation and ethnic group of people called Jews and Israel? To split: try to discern truth from lies and facts from fantasies. You are not engaged in "rightful critique" but in demonization of Jews. Deliver ONE proof that proves Israel is the "bad guy" and Arabs/Moslems are the "good guys". If you can't - don't bother.
43. ISRAEL
JEFF ,   MIAMI/JERUSALEM   (03.27.12)
JORDAN IS PALESTINE, 80% OF THE POPULATION. abass must be arrested and tried for murder, stop the ghetto mentality, institute the death penalty. oslo is dead stop the charade, islam is commited to the death of all other religions annex judea and samaria, rebuild the temple, cut off the money and water to our enemies, demilitarize gaza, remove the fake king of jordan, stop paying our murderers pensions, send the invented people back to jordan and let them have their state. might makes right in this world, as jews we are commanded to hate evil, destroy our evil murderers, and remove the fear from the minds of our children. be proud to be jews and of our wonderful history and contributions to civilization. Fear YHVH and keep The 10 Commandments..
44. To N 43
Luiz F Haddad ,   Niteroi, Brazil   (03.28.12)
No, Mr. Jeff. Palestine is not Jordan. Its territory belongs to Israel, at first, but also, to Arab dwellers. We, Democrats, true friends of the Jewish State, support new drawed frontiers, that don't endanger her security, and Jerusalem as her eternal capital. But Hammallah, Bethlehem, Jericho, Betanya, parts of Nazareth and Hebron, etc, must integrate a Palestinian State, since demilitarized and recognizing in fact Israel. There is no other right solution. God bless your people.
45. 42 ,...
split ,   US   (03.28.12)
Read my post at 80 ,... http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4206110,00.html Find and read Solzhenitsyn's book "200 years together" if you know Russian, German or French or be satisfied of English excerpts on line because there's no complete English translation and we know why ,... Tired of giving you hints and hear the same beat up excuses ,...
46. 42 - Deliver ONE proof that proves Israel is the "bad guy"
split ,   US   (03.28.12)
An Israeli Air Force dropped a one-ton bomb on a house in residential neighbourhood in Gaza City, one of the most densely populated areas in the world, in the attempt to kill Salah Shehadeh, who at that time was supposed to be in his apartment with his family ,... 14 souls, most of them woman, children and infants were killed... Another case ,... Nine Palestinians, mostly woman and children were killed in an Israeli air strike on the Gaza beach,... The list is long - Never heard a word of condemnation of Israeli state terrorism from Jewish cummunity around the world ,... A few years later a Palestinian in a revenge butchers a settler's family living in home on stolen from him land and the whole hell breaks loose,...
47. Who's "at home" was it before you came?
Donatus ,   Strasbourg, France   (03.28.12)
"the struggle for Palestinian independence is slowly turning into the struggle for our own existence." Right so, but one thing you forget: they (the Palestinians) were there and you, (the jewish immigrants) came there! What did you do to enjoy the traditional palestinian hospitality ?
48. To nr 47 - You display shocking ignorance
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.28.12)
I urge you people again to answer the simple question: who and what are the "Palestinians", and why is it that not one single ancient civilization has ever mentioned once any "Palestinian" people, state or country? Why is that? By contrast, many ancient civilizations have mentioned Jews and Israel - both as a territory and as a kingdom, several times. Most of the Arabs of Israel CAME TO ISRAEL in the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s WITHOUT any prior history in the land. We cannot enjoy any "Palestinian" hospitality for several reasons: 1) They are not "Palestinians". They are Arabs. 2) Moslem Arabs and Christian Arabs are not the natives nor the historical nor the ancient nor the original population of the land of Israel. 3) Jerusalem had a Jewish majority as late as the late 19th century. 4) Photographs taken by visiting Americans and Europeans reveal that the land of Israel was destroyed, desolate, unlovely and hardly a living soul in it - due to centuries of conquests made by foreigners in the Jewish homeland. 5) Most Israeli Arabs came here as recently as the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s in accordance with the British policy of letting Arabs move in and keeping Jews out in order to prevent a Jewish majority in Israel. 6) Arabs moved into Israel for two reasons: 6.1) to look for jobs in Jewish cities and industries that were built when Jews returned. 6.2) to destroy a future Jewish state demographically. Ethnic Arabs dominated Israel demographically less than 30 years in the 7th century AD. Most "Arabs" of Israel today and indeed the entire Arab world are not ethnic Arabs, but merely Arab speaking Moslems of predominantly Kurdish, Turkish, Persian, Berber, African, Egyptian, Sudanese, Somalian, North African, Tartar, Afghan, Bosnian, Albanian, Greek, Italian, Latin and German origins. Hardly any united distinct homogenous self aware or self conscious "Palestinian" nation.
49. To nr 45 - Yes I read your post
Alexander ,   Tel Aviv, Israel   (03.28.12)
And I can't say I'm impressed. You said that Jews were kicked out of many nations. How you came to the exact number of nations that have expelled Jews beats me. You said that since so many nations have kicked out Jews it has to mean something - meaning that you punish Jews collectively and hold us collectively "responsible" for supposed crimes we have "committed". As a response to you, I urge you to read my talkback nr 18 in here to prove the Jewish people's innocence and nr 19, to prove that Arabs and Moslems are not so innocent as you claim they are. If you accuse me of glorifying Jews and demonizing Arabs I will accuse you of glorifying Arabs and Moslems - despite evidence of their behaviour, and you demonize Jews, despite evidence that Jews haven't committed any of those crimes that I refered to in talkback nr 18. Jews were kicked out because of Jew hatred and anti-Semitism, mostly because of Christian and Moslem anti-Semitism. You said that Jews were kicked out - not WHY Jews were kicked out and what "crimes" the Jews supposedly have committed. I again have to reiterate my point from talkback nr 41: Can you improve this world by hating and entire nation and ethnic group of people called Jews and Israel? Read my talkback nr 18 again: Have you personally been a victim of those crimes in the hands of IDF, Israel and the Jewish people? Answer the question instead of delivering beat up excuses. How many nations have been victims of those crimes in the hands of IDF, Israel and the Jewish people? Answer the question instead of delivering beat up excuses. It's really strange how you think you can advance human civilization and brotherly love by spreading hate, racism and false accusations - and on top of that achieving nothing.
50. #46 split
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.28.12)
There was plenty of condemnation from Jews on those instances, along with an understanding that in many, the terrorists were hiding behind their own people. You pick and choose your words, ignore facts, and fill in the empty spaces with crap. Very typical of you.
51. #47 donatus
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.28.12)
The "Palestinians" declared themselves a ‘nation’ in the 1960’s as a political ploy to counter Israel (and admitted as such). This, after years insisting they are not “Palestinians” but Syrian arabs, Iraqi arabs, etc. The arabs first came with the Moslem conquest in the 600's AD (arabs from arabia - get it?). Jews and Berbers [who were already there] joined together to fight them. Read some history, then post.
52. All we have is a FOOT in the DOOR of our OWN HOME, to ....
Jerry ,   The Netherlands   (03.28.12)
achieve BALANCE we really NEED a SECURE BIG ISRAEL. It is the ONLY way to achieve peace! As an immigrant country we need a modern version of Hebrew (Yisraelit?) with pronounceable spelling, a few extra letters basically. We need to define Israel more strongly as a SECULAR state for all kinds of jews, with an official TRADITIONAL core culture. We need to experiment bravely and wisely with new social-economic-environmental "models" and practices to connect the economy up to physical reality again in stead of chasing financial abstractions. Internationally competitive, yet internally free to achieve a 3rd WAY. We really NEED a proper vision for PHASE TWO of PRACTICAL ZIONISM, to create a real HOMELAND for jews. Ad hoc politcal gameplaying won't suffice. We need to focus on a concrete GOAL.
53. 50 ,...
split ,   US   (03.28.12)
Does it look like condemnation ??? "Report: Shehadeh killing legitimate" http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4035172,00.html
54. #53 split
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.29.12)
I repeat: There was plenty of condemnation from Jews on those instances, along with an understanding that in many, the terrorists were hiding behind their own people. The inquiry came about because of condemnation by Israelis. The verdict came about because of the realization that he was hiding behind his family and others. You say nothing of the murders he committed. You speak of a few occurrences, then reference only one as you can't support your statements about the others. You accuse others of writing crap, while you are the expert. Congratulations.
55. Time to Tell Our Story
naz   (03.29.12)
You say: "Facing this message, we have to post one of our own that is no less powerful." But you cannot go on lying.
56. 54 - There was plenty of condemnation ,...
split ,   US   (03.29.12)
Happen to miss it if there was any and you fail to prove it ,...
57. #55 naz- one minor problem
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.30.12)
Israel is not lying. Sorry. Read some history, then post.
58. 57 - Israel is not lying.
split ,   US   (03.30.12)
Obviously ;) ,...
59. #58 split
solomon ,   bklyn   (03.30.12)
You do not know what you are talking about, no matter the subject under discussion. THAT has been obvious for a long, long time.
60. Bla, bla, bla,...
split ,   US   (03.31.12)
No one believes you anymore so it doesn't matter how you spin it ,...
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