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4 paratroopers jailed for refusing to clean
Yoav Zitun
Published: 08.04.12, 23:31
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16 Talkbacks for this article
1. JUST SAY NO
DA URBAN POET ,   SAFED OPERA HOUSE   (04.09.12)
2. perfectly proportional!
kapriza ,   tsafon   (04.09.12)
Refusing an order in the military is a serious offense. After all, they weren't being ordered to commit murder.
3. 4 paratroopers jailed
Rhonda ,   Chicago, USA   (04.09.12)
I was really sorry to read this. The paratroopers, well, they are the paratroopers and are highly respected. Yet, an order is an order in any army unless it is unethical or illegal and that's another matter entirely. Nevertheless, I am sorry this happened.
4. What a farce
BEN JABO ,   ISRAEL   (04.09.12)
Chayalim are put in jail, terrorists are roaming free Next step, give terrorists the guns so that they can guard the IDF
5. Again, some commander has his head up his butt.
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (04.09.12)
Never watched the Fiddler movie or heard the song, TRADITION, TRADITION, etc....... They want to keep the religious out, they want to make the religious upset by forcing them to listening to women singing, now to clean toilets or whatever when they have served almost all their time and are do to get out JUST to be a bully. They really want people to stay out don't they just so they can complain.
6. finally! end stupid IDF customs
aron ,   USA   (04.09.12)
Having served in a combat infantry for 2 years in Gaza and Lebanon, I had been on the receiving end of this backwards custom for many many months at a time. This ridiculous fraternity behavior has no business in a modern army...as it drastically reduces the awareness and effectiveness of every soldier on the battlefield. Young soldier's sleep an extremely small amount compared to veteran soldiers (we're talking 4 non-consecutive hours a night.) The result is = YOUNG SOLDIERS ON PATROL IN GAZA ARE ASLEEP IN THEIR HUMMERS!! This is solely because the work is not divided up equally and the veteran soldiers have more time to themselves than what they know what to do with. Good job Tzahal for sending those vatikim to jail. Finally this ridiculousness is being put to an end. If this BS is abolished in all units...Israel would be a much safer place :)
7. A BORED MEDIA
Yaacov Wolf ,   Herzylia, Israel   (04.09.12)
Who cares what 4 soldiers got up to?Really! This happens on a regular basis but never gets reported. Why the sudden interest? No 'big' headlines with Iran or American Jews. Enough negative spotlight on the combat soldiers, we really don't need that right now.
8. Hazing the rookies isn't only Givati
Yoseff ,   Jerusalem   (04.09.12)
There's a lot of talk going on about the Tsabar Givati battalion. How they beat the rookie soldiers, etc. This is a widespread occurrence in infantry. Not only present in Givati, but almost all of infantry. Its a tradition that's been passed down for years. One that is optional. If you don't agree with being hazed, you can opt out of it. And the senior soldiers will respect that. Seemingly, these 4 soldiers went through the "hazing process" of the first year in their company. They deserve to be excluded from the low work. They've earned that right. And they shouldn't have received a single day in jail. The battalion commanders in infantry need to realize that the army isn't a utopia. Its difficult giving up 3 years of your youth. And that this optional hazing process is a way of making that time speed up. This needn't have been dealt with on a battalion level. Rather on a company, or even platoon level. These men received jail because of the incompetence of their commanding officers. And the inability to accept that long standing traditions of the company.
9. #4, What do you know about the service?
Michael ,   California, USA   (04.09.12)
Chayalim are in jail all the time for various offences, from not shaving to much more serious offenses. Those four paratroopers refused an order, which is a major offense. What are you invoking terrorists for in a most stupid way? It's time to let you free from the minute service you are still doing because you cannot think straight any more. Now, I'll be expecting another from your imbecile replies after you consult with your wife.
10. # 6 Aron, this is similar to
Bad Assed Jew ,   United States   (04.09.12)
first year Dr. interns whose sleep depravation is critical, to the young Dr's. and the patients. While I agree reform is very much needed, no one can be exempt from following the orders in any army ( unless in rare cases ) or chaos will follow. Shalom.
11. Time for a volunteer army...
Orly ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (04.09.12)
... only a portion of elligible draftees serve full duty (well less than half). Meanwhile, it costs the military billions to house and feed the less useful among them and to pay contract workers to clean basic amenities like restrooms and showers (something that exists in no other country). There are more than enough army-age citizens interested in serving in the military and doing whatever they are told to do. There are enough of these that even the guy (or gal) whose job it is to figure out what happened to that lost order of socks is fit for combat. The army can be selective, save money and have willing and able soldiers who can receive ample compensation for their services - all this while relieving social tensions and saving huge chunks in the national budget.
12. Give me a Break
Ben ,   Israel   (04.09.12)
These soldiers are spoiled children who are lazy. I was in the army and if my commander asked me to clean something I did it. These are not people that have been in heavy fighting for months. They do simply gaurd duty and occasioanlly arrest someone. They should get off their butts and contribute work to the unit. Good for the Commander. The army is too full of cry babies!
13. Hazing? Really?
Benjamin Ben-Ari ,   Israel   (04.09.12)
Excuse me but being asked/ordered to clean the bathroom of kitchen is not hazingf. Figure out the difference. I was a Vatik and if a job needed to be done then someone should do. These soldiers are just lazy. It is a stupid policy and should be abolished. If a job needs to be done then someone should do it, regardless of how long they have been in the army. The IDF is too full of cry babies, who do nothing but complain
14. 11
zionist forever   (04.09.12)
The problem with a volunteer army is manpower. Israel just doesn't have a large enough population for a volunteer army. There are about 7 million individuals living in Israel right now. About 1.2 million arabs, there is the elderly, there are people to young to serve, the people who are not physically able because of a medical condition and finally you have the people who do not want a military career. Right now there is a total ( air force, navy and army combined ) a maximum of 15,000 - 20,000 career soldiers. Whats the point of having 1000 tanks, 300 planes & 6 submarines, if you don't have enough people to man them in wartime. The arabs also operate the same kind of reservist based military for the same reasons as Israel and they don't have the manpower to rely on a volunteer army. Volunteer armies are luxuries that only countries with large populations can afford to have.
15. #9 Michael, I served you ran away
BEN JABO ,   ISRAEL   (04.09.12)
I will consult my wife right after you see your shrink
16. #11 Ora - I hate to inform you
BEN JABO ,   ISRAEL   (04.10.12)
When I was stationed in the American Army (Japan) we hired civilan's to do the KP, clean the latrines, mop the floors., clean & press our uniforms, shine our shoes, etc. These extra services do exist in other armies, don't jump the gun by denying that they don't until you check it out first Israel isn't large enough to sustain an "all volunteer army", not nearly enough manpower to do it America, which is much larger than Israel, is now downsizing it's own armed forces, cost being the main factor
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