Opinion  Ron Ben-Yishai
The Palestinian illusion
Ron Ben-Yishai
Published: 30.09.12, 14:10
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31. #9 Everybody can see how the UN perform
Raphael ,   Netanya   (10.01.12)
Just have a look across the border and see how the syrian people is being exterminated without anybody raising a finger to help. Do you believe the international community would do better against Israel, if a sustainable solution of the palestinian question would be implemented?
32. Balance=NONVIOLENT TRANSFER to the MANY Arab/Muslim lands.
Jerry ,   The Netherlands   (10.01.12)
33. Who cares about another intifada ?
David ,   Israel   (10.01.12)
We are more then capable of dealing with it from experience of the past two.. So much so that there are plenty of combat units in the army excited at the prospect so they can finally see some action in their service after all the boring guarding and 17 days straight away from home each time. The Palestinians could have had a state countless times but they ruin it for themselves.
34. Please read this in context of Barak's statements
Tracy W   (10.01.12)
Defense Minister Ehud Barak recently made a statement in favor of DISENGAGEMENT from all except the major settlements. He added that those Jews who did not wish to evacuate their homes could remain within under Palestinian rule! He compared peace in Judea and Samaria with "friction" with Gaza. He said that it was only time till Arab violence erupted in Judea and Samaria, so it was better to disengage now. So Minister Barak, along with Minister Avigdor Lieberman who supports his idea, appear to follow this path of thinking: 1) Disengagement from Gaza led to constant friction, war and the threat of more wars to come, rocket attacks against Jewish communities near the border, rule of Gaza by Hamas, and their alliance with the most extreme ME factions. 2) PA under some control by the IDF has resulted in mostly peace. Peace for now at least. And if violence erupts, the IDF has some control to protect Israeli citizens. So, since this system works better than disengagement ..................Barak wants to repeat the disengagement experience! It does not make any sense, but leftist thinking never does. Disengagement from Judea and Samaria would be infinitely worse than the Gaza situation because of closer Arab access to a large number of Israeli towns, the airport, etc.. The PA would soon arm itself to the teeth and establish an alliance with extreme nations and factions. They would launch rockets into Israel, dig tunnels, and wreak havoc in order to "liberate" the land. Israel would have its hands tied behind its back because the PA would engage the support of Iran and UN Security Council members. (Think of Western helplessness as the Syrian situation continues.) Any collateral damage - which is inevitable since that would be urban warfare - would turn the whole world against Israel. And we already know how well this works in restraining Israel's right to self defense. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ As you remember the government commissioned the Levy Report, which concluded that Israel has legal right to the land in Judea and Samaria. The government knew the outcome ahead of time because of the existence of solid legal documentation dating from the League of Nations Mandate and the St Remo Conference that back up Israel's right to the land. The government's real agenda behind the Levy Report was to have a renewed legal framework to retain the major settlements. That's all. And disengage from the rest. Since there is no logical, legal or security reason for another disengagement, the government and the left are now using the fear of an Arab uprising as excuse to proceed with a disengagement.
35. #26 Jarda - speaking of thieves
Gee ,   Zikron Yaakov   (10.01.12)
There is the Czechs that ethnically cleansed Sudeten Germans from their homes and businesses. Over 3 million Germans were ethnically cleansed and their homes & business STOLEN by CZECHS. Maybe you thieves should be punished for your thefts.
36. #26 thieves of what?
William ,   Israel   (10.01.12)
How can you steal from someone something that was never their's? Conversely, Jews have an awful lot of land with Arab squatters on it, and the land deeds to prove it. Surely, you're not suggesting that the Ottoman Records showing only 2.3% of land was in Arab private hands as a "Zionist" ploy, are you?
37. #27 - not just CNN, but many others
William ,   Israel   (10.01.12)
Arafat was also caught admitting that the Oslo Accords was a farce to pacify Israel, that his use of violence in 2000 was to gain more concessions, and that the intifada had already been planned for 1 year prior. His own minister admitted the latter part. Sorry, but despite your love for Arafat, the horrible truth is that he is a terrorist who had no intention on peaceful coexistence. Even Clinton was shocked at how good a deal Arafat got and his rejection of it. He warned Arafat twice not to walk away - even when Arafat was claiming the Jewish temple never existed in Jerusalem.
38. To No. 36
Bertram ,   London, UK   (10.02.12)
So, are you suggesting that because the Ottoman Empire deprived the Arabs of their land it is legitimate for Zionists to do the same thing?
39. #9, Been There Done That
RickD ,   USA   (10.02.12)
What you ask for was already offered to Arafat in 2000. He didn't even say No. He just walked away, and then bragged about turning over the table on Israel. It was offered again in 2008 by Olmert to Abbas. Also, there was no response. Pals have never negotiated in good faith. When you say that you will agree if only you get a fair offer I say you are lying. You will never agree.
40. #34 Tracy
Keren ,   IL-BR   (10.02.12)
Barak(and Liberman)want to make Israel completely porous and ABSOLUTELY vulnerable.It is a deliver on a platter,a piece of cake to Arabs. It is incredible!Any child sees that,but they keep in the verge of destruction. Is that something comprehensible? And I fear Netanyahu, because Netanyahu has kept Barak as Defense Minister. Why?
41. Abbas is worthless and is incapable of making the bold decis
ALBERTO   (10.02.12)
42. #34, Ehud Barak trying to preempt UNGA/SC Palestine WB rule
Steven Benassi ,   Silver Bay, MN USA   (10.02.12)
...by annexing large settlement blocks before UN imposes '67 borders on Israel.
43. #38 try a reading comprehension course
Gee ,   Zikron Yaakov   (10.02.12)
He stated that it was never their land in the first place. Arabs are from ..... wait for it .... ARABIA. Hence they aren't the natives. Guess what Jews are from JUDEA. It's our land and they are not allowed to steal it
44. I am so scared
Zev ,   Israel   (10.02.12)
I want to give up and give the Arabs everything that they want. I am not willing to fight anymore. Give me a break Ron. Israel would not exist if we had such weak people in 1948.
45. waiting for part 2 but suggest you talk to benny morris in t
ilana   (10.02.12)
waiting for part two of your article but i suggest you talk to benny morris before you write anymore
46. AS IF
(10.02.12)
THE ENEMY IS THE WEAK PALASTINIANS AND THE SLIT EYE OF IRAN
47. To No. 43
Bertram ,   London, UK   (10.02.12)
I can state the moon is made of green cheese but unfortunately it does not make it correct. If you want to argue on what is called a primordial basis, then the Jews were not the original inhabitantsof the land either. Indeed, if you were to apply the primordial principle to the entire world the global map would look very different! It's a nonsensical arguement and you know it. The case for Israel is strong because it is a well-established nation-state - and because of a history of persecution and genocide. It is the national homeland for Jews. However, pre-1948 Palestine was also the home for other people. It is possible that everyone - Jews and Arabs - is prepared to endure decades, if not centuries, of continual conflict, death and destruction while each side sticks to the rightness of their position. Force of arms on either side simply makes the other dig in even further. The other possibility is a political solution - not perfect for either Jews or Arabs - but better than the alternative.
48. Secular MENA, BIG ISRAEL, READABLE "abjads", CO-OPERATION.
Jerry ,   The Netherlands   (10.02.12)
49. #40 Keren - the reason why?
Tracy W   (10.02.12)
I think you and I know why the leadership behave the way they do, but 'the problem' can't be expressed here. 'The problem' exists at the highest levels of government, in the Yesha Civil Administration - and at the grassroots level. I mention grassroots level because of their refusal to make the demand for sovereignty a first priority. They know full well that without sovereignty, much of their "build-build" program can end up in more expulsions. Settlers were expelled from Sinai and Gaza because they had failed to demand annexation. I really hope Israeli Jews will form an independent and effective organization to demand sovereignty. As long as they remain divided and without clout, the government can do what it wants.
50. #42 Steve
Tracy W   (10.02.12)
There has been a big act of deception and denial going on for years - starting with the shelving of the still legal League of Nations Mandate Agreement and the St Remo Conference Agreement. Successive Israeli governments have been part of that act of denial. They just don't talk about it, as if it had never existed - although those documents support Israel's right to the land. The UN has no right to partition Israel because it is obligated to abide by all agreements signed by its predecessor, the League of Nations. The government should break its silence about the legality of the settlements according to international law. But it won't do that unless the people of Israel demand it.
51. #49 Tracy
Keren ,   IL-BR   (10.02.12)
Actually ,quite honestly ,I can not understand what´s 'the problem'in the leadership´s behavior in Israel. These political/power gymnastics, that are so far from the real and truthful core of the human,hystorical ,dramatic Jewish issues,are too much to be understandable.
52. #52 Keren
Tracy W   (10.03.12)
The "problem" has to do with the integrity of your leadership. It is not because of a lack of understanding on their part. They know exactly what they're doing and what the consequences of their actions - and inactions - will be. Egypt is keeping Sinai but demanding changes to the treaty (changes to make it easier for them to launch another war against Israel). And rockets still being launched from Gaza. Anyway, even at this point your leadership won't let facts get in the way of surrendering the West Bank - either through a treaty or disengagement. I can't be more specific about what motivates your politicians. Too many of my talkbacks get censored.
53. #33 David...BEST COMMENT
Netanya ,   Netanya   (10.03.12)
Did we finish the second intifada? Have we achieved peace and I was sleeping? Just yesterday a pali cab ran into IDF soldiers who had their car on the side of the road..just rammed into them. Have we found some peace or maybe we need to realize that the last intifada ended when their tactic of suicide bombers became highly publicized and used against them and Israel built a fence to keep them out. The palis only go from one tactic to another and the only thing is they are not called intifadas, but who cares what we call them. The author is really lost and living in a dream world where just giving away land, like Gaza, leads to some peace. That is just not based on the truth of the situation. If Jews had another country, like the Muslims do, actually 57 countries, 22 in the Middle East alone, the Jews would go there. The palis have no claim here, since they are no different from the other Arabs who love to murder others and their brothers too.
54. #52 Tracy
Keren ,   IL-BR   (10.03.12)
Clarifying talkbacks should not be censored, because it is in the interest of all,including internet moderators,that truth,sanity,good sense...prevail in politics and in life in general. The fact leadership won't let facts get in the way of surrendering the West Bank is a really puzzling fact ,because there is no money and no power in this world(if that´s the "problem" )that can substitute what is really true in life, and what is really true in life,the first pionners who came to Israel knew it better.It is called idealism. The problem are the wolves who get to meddle into good faith,and that´s indeed crazy,and there is no explanation for crazyness.Crazyness is only rid by constant and incessant claryfication based on Truth.
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