Jewish Scene
Female kosher supervisors deemed 'immodest'
Ynet
Published: 12.11.12, 16:17
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1. Talmud
Leon ,   SP-BRazil   (11.12.12)
"Woman is a sack of excrement and her mouth is full of blood, but all run after her" (Shabbat 152a).
2. Rabbinate is invalid by standard of Devorah!!!
Cyberbrain ,   Israel   (11.12.12)
3. While at this hassle, declare 'white meat' kosher.
Michael ,   California, USA   (11.12.12)
It is time to update the rules after many years. Kashrut ideas exist from before refrigeration, which makes no sense any more. White meat is very popular, inexpensive and widely marketed around the world, so why not in Israel?
4. Welcome to the 21st century
Norman Gellman ,   Rehovot   (11.12.12)
It's time the rabbis wake up to the fact we are now in the 21st century. Where does modesty come into kosher supervision. Do they have thing about taking introductions from a female? I wish the ladies success in their undertaking.
5. Feminists once again craving for attention
Shalom ,   Israel   (11.12.12)
If Rabbi Amar has already made the subject clear, then why do they keep on making such a huge problem out of nothing? If they don't want to accept it, then why don't they start their own brand of kashrut? Why do they think they know what is best for the Rabbinates policy? Oh and the Rabbinate was created for the Tradionalist HAREDI Jews in Israel, not for chutzpah feminists why think they know it all.
6. every day rabbis show themselves to be no better then common
men & women ,   they are a joke   (11.12.12)
7. @3 What, You Can't Get Chicken?
emanon ,   USA   (11.12.12)
8. Kashrut Supervision
MR ,   Beit Shemesh, Israel   (11.12.12)
Considering how many Kashrut decisions are decided every day by these rabbis' wives, in their own homes, this seems a bit ridiculous. On the other hand, given that charedi women tend to have many more career options due to their superior education and higher level of work experience, this may be a protectionist strategy to preserve one of the few fields that many avreichim are qualified to work in. But, the rabbinate will never admit to it because to do so would undermine their overall agenda of keeping men in kollel or in "Torah-oriented" jobs and families in their community poor and ignorant.
9. @5 be careful what you wish for.
rebecca ,   Modiin   (11.12.12)
Already there are moves to have separate Rabbinical councils for Marriage, Kashrut, Mikvot etc, simply because the current Rabbinical council is steadily becoming more difficult to work with. They keep introducing more rules that are stricter and more difficult to explain other than "they dont want ...". In this case we already have female Kashrut supervisors. And they are not justifying the increased strictness of their ruling. Making different councils is not happening because of feminists. Many learned Rabbim are getting involved.
10. #1's comment is highly offensive & doesnt contribute 2....
(11.12.12)
discussion. I have one question for Leon: Where did woman come from? go on then quote me chapter and verse from the Torah.
11. This chief rabbi best not b eatin' at his mother's house...
(11.12.12)
or at his wife's table...after all unless these two women closest to him are being properly supervised then his eating of the food they prepared is immoral.
12. Who is the Rabbinate for?
Ethan Schwartz ,   Eilat   (11.12.12)
I thought it is for all Jews, but they think they are only for the most extreme of us.
13. Yet another reason to break the Chief Rabbinate monopoly
Raymond in DC ,   Washington, USA   (11.12.12)
Here in the US we have several independent kashrut authorities, plus individual supervision for those "ultras" who only trust their own rabbi. In so many areas, "absolute power" has clearly corrupted the Chief Rabbinate. It's not surprising they're held in such low regard in Israel. Forty years ago haredim were just one small camp in Israel. With their numbers today, they're all out to demonstrate how only they and their ways are "frum" enough.
14. White Meat
Ellen ,   Israel/NYC   (11.13.12)
# 3--you are sounding like a fool. White meat --for those who do not realize is the term that used to be used in Hebrew to refer to Ham. The issue of women working as a mashigach is one thing--and there is no reason why a female can't do this job. However, in the Torah it clearly states which animals are and are not Kosher. Pigs do NOT meet the criteria. It has nothing to do with refrigeration. Beef and chicken can spoil if improperly handled, same as pig.
15. Don't eat the food in Boca Raton
Mordechai   (11.13.12)
Next time you come to Boca Raton to raise money make sure not to eat any food. The ORB the Orthodox Rabbinical Council of Broward and Palm Beach County hires female kashrut supervisors. Also they do the supervision in Orlando so when you go to Disney for yeshiva break no food for you. This isn't about haredi, or the rabbinate its about a few ignoramous's who are not Torah scholars trying to keep the jobs for their unqualified friends and students.
16. What may have been immodest 100 years ago
Zev ,   Israel   (11.13.12)
does not make it immodest today. Times change and there are those that think that there can be no changes in Judaism. But Judaism is a religion for the living and there are decisions that are based on the situation at that time.Some rabbis are afraid to change even if the original reason is no longer relevent.
17. Jewish teliban taking over
Haim ,   TA   (11.13.12)
Just goes to show how they view women.
18. Disgusting!
Jew1 ,   Ashdod   (11.13.12)
Judaisum is going down the drain. We are turning into taliban. This is just another try to undermine woman's rights. They are just trying to keep the job for their uneducated men friends who are good for nothing. Please go ahead. Do the petition and win the case. I hope that many other woman's organizations are created to fight for haredi woman's rights.
19. I read most of these posts and
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   www.netzarim.co.il   (11.13.12)
maybe there IS some hope after all.
20. # 3 and # 14
Madeleine ,   Israel   (11.13.12)
#14 - you are right about white meat. It refers not only to ham but any meat from a pig. Even the goyim know that at certain times of the year pork - and shellfish too, for that matter - are unclean; as I learnt in catering : "if there is no letter 'r' in the month you don't eat these foods'. Pigs are known to harbour tapeworm which can transfer itself to the person who eats unclean pork. Chicken is never referred to - at least not by Jews - as 'white meat'.
21. The ace of trump + the jocker
Norman Gellman ,   Rehovot   (11.13.12)
The modesty issue is the rabbinate's trump card and/or joker. Modesty has no measurable states it's all a matter of perception so when the rabbinate wishes to hold back women or prevent them from doing something they play the morality card as it's a joker it takes on form and as the ace of trump it can't be beat. So this a great strategy to hold women down. If we are smart we would ignore all their prostrations involving female when modesty. when in fact by playing this card they are the immodest ones.
22. Here in Montreal the Vaad Hair is no different
Al   (11.13.12)
A monopoly of ultra dumb wack jobs who do more to discourage people from keeping kosher. There was a time when kosher supervision in Montreal was led by people who understood people. Today we have a gang of meshugoyim who are in the business of ruining small kosher businesses, with their insane regulations. No small wonder that it turns people off from kosher and religion in general. Its time that kosher supervision be restored to the community and away from these treife RABBIS.
23. What could be more appropriate?
Sherlock Holmes ,   London England   (11.13.12)
Kashrus is a special area for women looking after family and home. What could be more appropriate than women supervising kashrus? I can't see a problem of yichud, assuming there is more than one other employee and the doors are open. If there were a real issue it would not take months of discussion.
24. THE KASHRUT MAFIA
Les Szenes ,   Richmond Hill   (11.13.12)
It is acceptable for women to have their babies, cook, clean, and serve them hand and foot. If their appearance offends them they can always avoid going to those places. Their attitude offends me so I avoid them like the the PLAGUE. That is what they are with their "men" only fraternities.
25. 15 Nepotism?
Danny ,   London England   (11.13.12)
Giving jobs to your unqualified friends and students can apply equally to unqualified female friends and students. Although the word nepotism refers to nephews, it can also include nieces! I'm on the Haredi end of the Orthodox spectrum and I can see no reason not to appoint female kashrus supervisors unless there are specific problems in specific kitchens. As far as I'm aware the Haredi hechsher here in London allows female kashrus supervisors.
26. #20, This meat is healthy, tastes good, is very popular.
Michael ,   California, USA   (11.13.12)
But don't take my word for it, ask nutrition experts around the world. The information you have is limited to a small group of people, is unsubstantiated, based on irrelevant beliefs.
27. #3 Michael - Many places don't have
BEN JABO (MACHAL) ,   ISRAEL   (11.13.12)
Electricity or refrigeration Ever hear of Trichinosis, which could put your life at risk? I suggest that you consult some of the people on Obama’s board, there must be someone of the 15 that is familiar with the disease
28. #4 Norman Gelman
BEN JABO (MACHAL) ,   ISRAEL   (11.13.12)
Women during their "Time of the Month" are unclean, even their husbands avoid contact
29. #27, Thanks to Machal Israel has electricity & refrigeration
Michael ,   California, USA   (11.13.12)
Is Ynet Israeli website? Is Machal in Israel? I didn't know Obama is Israeli interested in kashrut.
30. #29 Michael, what are you ranting ablut?
BEN JABO (MACHAL) ,   ISRAEL   (11.13.12)
You're making less sense than you usually do. A lot of countries don't have access to electricity, much less refrigeration
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