Probe: Soldier failed to discharge weapon at intruders
Yoav Zitun
Published: 21.12.12, 23:23
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1. "Soldier acted appropriately"
Frozen ,   Toronto, Canada   (12.22.12)
What a joke. I wonder what inappropriate would be like, having some tea with them before handing over the gun? how ridiculous?
2. nice one # 1 ;-)
3. every bus made in Korea has....
Bluegrass Picker ,   Afula   (12.22.12)
viewport & mirror arrangements set up to provide full visibility & situational awareness for the driver. Wake up, Armored Corps!!!
4. Soldier on duty
Rhonda ,   Chicago, USA   (12.22.12)
Yea and if he shot and killed the both of them then the world would all be in an uproar. I'm sure he did the best he could and I wish him well during the rest of his service.
5. #1
Malone ,   Hfx   (12.22.12)
You're a moron..enough said there.
6. A rifle in a small enclosed area....
Malone ,   Hfx   (12.22.12)'s intended for long range..for close quarter fighting small arms or an uzi is better..however,on a dark stormy night,at 0200,on his own base,he probably didn't expect to be attacked,and maybe wasn't as alert as he should have been...don't blame the soldier...I've been in that position back in the day..could happen to any of us...yet we have comments from #1 "frozen" who has never been in that situation,but finds it easy to condemn..pathetic
7. #1
Hatikva ,   Buenos Aires   (12.22.12)
I totally agree. Appropriate action would've been to shoot trespassors and to alert the base. They could've killed or severely injured (or kidnapped) the soldier. Alertness levels should be raised throught Judea and Samaria and the border bases.
8. What a wimp...
Avi ,   Israel   (12.22.12)
I guess he was frozen in fear...
9. whose there? said little red ridding hood
ky   (12.22.12)
"Its not Mr Wolf, its only little me and I've n got some nice red apples for you " Whats the point of having fairy stories if we cant learn anything from them
10. A fairy tale
A Base ,   France Paris   (12.22.12)
"He tried to discharge his rifle but failed, resorting instead to hitting them with the weapon's barrel, to no avail. "
11. The two dudes brought in some pot
Miron ,   USA   (12.22.12)
but instead of usual sabra with a few sheckels and stack of cards waiting fun times found a new Russian immigree...
12. #1 Toronto?
Avramele   (12.22.12)
Really Eh? You are obviously a man of great experience and expertise. Thanks.
13. "Who's There?" He's Not Sayeret Matkal
Seth ,   Washington, DC   (12.22.12)
14. Poor reporting
Austin ,   Vancouver Canada   (12.22.12)
Wgatever the reorter is talking about it makes little sense in at least one respect. There is NO door to the observation tower, so what did he "open"" And are the reports not checked for accuracy. This was a very basic, simple matter.
15. #1 Comment
ltrail ,   United States   (12.22.12)
You obviously have never been in the same situation. Mistakes can, and do happen. Want to knock on his door next time?
16. Only 2 words...
Golani ,   Harezt   (12.22.12)
Lucky idiot...
17. Screw you armchair generals
Joe ,   Israel   (12.22.12)
None of you has even as much walked up into a guard tower, let alone guarded in one on a freezing night in middle of a storm. I have, and I can confidently say that this soldier acted appropriately and even if it was the Rambo of Sayeret Matkal up there the incident would have still ended the same. So don't go judging the soldier you useless POS. Bunch of tough guys (and gals...) over the internet. Hell, if most of you were in that guard tower you would've pissed yourself, forget about fighting back.
18. Soldiers in Judea and Samaria
Son Of Cyrus   (12.22.12)
Hope you have learnt your lessons over the past few weeks. The Arabs are deliberately trying to create incidents for propaganda purposes, however, please shoot first ask questions later.
19. Why was he alone?
Concerned ,   USA   (12.22.12)
20. 2 aspects to consider :
Barbara ,   Haifa Israel   (12.22.12)
First the soldier is lucky to not be kidnapped. The other is that our security methods still stink. IDF - you've got to start thinking out of the box and like a desperate Arab.
21. he Sold it
ZOOZ ,   Gaza   (12.22.12)
a rifle will be sold in WB at least for 30-50 K NIS In return for a peper spray in the face and a small hit on the head , anyone will do it for 50 K try to investigate this
22. most of you missed the point of #1
naava ,   jerusalem   (12.22.12)
He wasn't criticizing the soldier. He was as aghast as i am at the protocol of our army. Lawyers and cameras in the front lines, fearful of world condemnation, DM who forgot what is Defense, Generals who want to be politically correct and training our soldiers to "have tea" with the terrorists will continue to lose lives and make fools of us. We have only the higher echelons to blame not this soldier who obviously did the best he could given that he is not allowed to discharge his gun until the intruders have signed a paper saying they are there for harm. Only then is he allowed to defend himself. Until then our army and leaders expect our soldiers to indeed have tea first. #1 is right on the money.
23. I've got a security idea after reading this again
Barbara ,   Haifa Israel   (12.22.12)
IDF needs alarms at fences (for when they are cut) and guard needs button alarm (like in banks) to alert the base. It is perfectly understandable in certain weather conditions and guard's alertness - to let your guard down. We are humans, no?
24. You guys are pathetic...
Golani ,   Harezt   (12.22.12)
Dont they have or even use ”sisma” in the Artillery Corps? Any one with even a little brain has heard about the use of the low visibility due to bad weather in the strip. Asking once “who is there” while sitting on the top of an observation tower, may be acceptable since your job is to observe from distance, (and not patrolling the area). So he fought back when he realize he blow it… What choice did he have? I may understand the first “who is there”… But not the second… After not getting any answer for his first “who is there”, any normal human been knowing the ground facts in the area, should have charge his weapon and ask for the sisma… No sisma… Shot first in the air, or even better, shot through the door… His conduct has to be considered as directly breaking the rules of engagement… He is a lucky… And so his mother, father and brothers/sisters… But an idiot as well… Probably a young solder… Nr. 5… You are the moron… Nr. 6… It sounds to me you want us believe you are some kind of expert in warfare, or close combat… Let me remember you few thing. a- Uzi is no longer used in the IDF as standard weapon since the late 70. b- In the Artillery Corps is Galil standard weapon which is a perfect weapon for close combat or in close quarter fighting as you call it… It can not happen to anyone of us… Too many solders are died during Israel history… Anyone of use should have learned of history… Nr. 15… There is no room for mistake in war zone/time… In this situation there are rules of engagement… Very simple rules… a- Ask for the sisma (password for the entire area) b- No answer… Charge you weapon, c- Ask for the sisma again… c- No answer… d- Shoot to kill… And safe your mother for tears… Nr. 18… Agreed with you…
25. #19- Why alone?
Get Real ,   UK   (12.22.12)
Exactly, and why no close cover, especially in view of the recent upsurge in Palestinian violence. Were the intruders intent on murder the outcome here could have been so different; fortunately the soldier lived.IDF must learn from this and improve its security levels at such bases.
26. #22 Naava - v.good comment /Guys, read this for translation
Mark   (12.22.12)
Naava is correct. The IDF has been given conflicting messages. They're supposed to be soldiers but at the same time they've been told that discharging a weapon can get them sent to jail for months or years. The definition of 'threat to soldiers' lives' too is deliberate vague, so as to make it practically impossible to shoot.
27. When a story makes no sense...Israelis believe it...
Mikesailor ,   Miami, FL   (12.22.12)
Sometimes one wonders at the unbelievable gullibility of both the Israeli public and media. This story makes no sense whatsoever. Two Palestinians infiltrate a military base with 1) a toy gun they leave behind and 2) pepper spray. The soldier receives no injuries except a bump on the head. No shots fired, no critical injuries, no...nothing. The only real consequence is one missing gun. Could it be just as likely that he traded the gun, sold the gun etc. Or that the 'infiltrators' weren't Palestinian, if they existed at all. Somehow this has been played up as a 'terrorist' or 'near-terrorist' attack when it seems either complete incompetence or something a bit more nefarious. Only in Israel will they support the soldier, even when the soldier is making up a story to cover his own butt. As long as he can blame a Palestinain for his predicament, all is forgiven and investigations cease. Because no Israeli really wants to know the truth when blaming the 'usual suspects' will suffice.
28. #18 Son - At night when you can't see the person
meir elazar   (12.22.12)
If they don't answer, shoot a warning shot through the roof of the guard tower but never open the door without confirming the identity of the intruder and that the person is actually authorized to be there. If they attempt to break down the door then shoot. But too many accidents in similar situation have cost lives. Classic example is "Cast a Giant Shadow"
29. #21
A Base ,   France Paris   (12.22.12)
You are right , the hole story stinks . The possibility he sold the rifle is big. "He tried to discharge his rifle but failed," LOL I used to shoot with an "old" in Vietnam captures M16 and I can´t remember the rifle ever jammed.
30.  Criminal ? - My foot !
Gabe ,   Canada   (12.22.12)
Criminals do not break into an Army base for a gun ! They buy guns on the black market. It was a well planned test run for something that is in the planning stage.
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