Opinion
Civil revolt
Elad Zeret
Published: 19.02.13, 10:53
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49 Talkbacks for this article
31. 'We have civil unions now.
Susan ,   Kfar Saba   (02.19.13)
A lot of couples who are not eligible to get married here and some who are but dont want to, go to a lawyer who makes them up a contract. I'm not exactly sure what is in the contract, but I have met several people recently who have done this and they are happy. On the other hand. I dont want to see the destruction that intermarriagge has done to our people abroad. Im against allowing any other but orthodox marriage here. However, the haredim have control over the rabbinite. I hope with the election results we will get some different rabbis in there who will behave in a more normal manner.
32. Democracy is more than just the right to vote
Ferdinand ,   Israel & France   (02.19.13)
Very doubtful a country can be called democratic if it denies people the right to marry whom they want. Most American Jews would not be allowed to marry an Israeli Jew in Israel. This practice is more akin of Iran than a democratic state and needs to stop.
33. A few words.
Northern   (02.19.13)
I didn't read any of the talkbacks here yet, because I already know what it's going to look like: A few supporters, but then a large crowd of people who oppose civil marriage and who are going to start babbling something about how this is a Jewish state, and therefore... well what? what does it really mean? So, Israel is a Jewish state! But what does it mean to be Jewish? Who the hell are you to decide for everybody else what it means to be Jewish? It is utterly unacceptable that in a Jewish state, Jews will have less religious freedom than do Jews in Europe and north America. For me, the most important value of a Jewish state is that every Jew gets to decide for THEMSELVES what it means to be Jewish. Just because you oppose assimilation, or intermarriage doesn't mean that you get to enlist other people into the fight against it. The right of an individual person to marry whomever they want takes precedence over your "right" to preserve Jewish identity. Identity can not and will not come through coercion.
34. a more sane country
Sherlock Holmes ,   London England   (02.19.13)
You answered your own question. Move to a more sane country, such as Germany? You have that right, if that's where your wife is from, and no one is stopping you.
35. Number 26 Theocracy and democracy
Danny ,   London England   (02.19.13)
No country has to recognise gay marriage. A generation back no onwould have dreamt of making such a suggestion, yet they were democratic countries. Judaism may be able to co-exist with civil partnership, but same-sex marriage is contrary to how Judaism defines marriage.
36. #5 Akiva, Your ideas are disgusting.
Michael ,   California, USA   (02.19.13)
Israel is NOT a Jewish country, it is an Israeli country. Jews are one of the groups of people who live in Israel, the majority are secular and therefore not Jewish in the sense that you are. But all of the citizens of Israel are included as Israelis. You are not allowed to pressure your religious concepts on anyone else. The ideas you promote are disgusting and are failing.
37. #33
Esther ,   NL   (02.19.13)
great points, well said!!
38. I agree with the author
American Sabrah ,   Israel   (02.20.13)
As an enlightened progressive country, its mind boggling that Israel won't recognize the rights for homosexuals to marry, for a man to have more than one wife, for people to marry as young as 16 without parental consent,for a brother and a sister to marry etc. After all, why should our religion,cultural background, age,and sexual orientation should prevent us from marrying whoever we love? Hell, if I wanted another man in addition to my marriage with my husband, I would take him in as well. Or if I wanted to marry my son, I shouldn't be denied the right to do so. If I and my partner are tested positive for AIDs and STD's, why should I give a rat's ass about future medical ramifications that may effect our children when my need to express my love is more important? Most liberal and enlightened countries would allow me to do so. Unfortunately, Israel is not one of them. We are living in the 21st century for cryin' out loud! When is Israel going to go through a reformation with their social issues already? It's all about love!!
39. Move to another sane country,try Iran or Iraq or Egypt
Dany Toren ,   Haifa Israel   (02.20.13)
It is a bad law,but knocking the whole country because you are not allowed a civil marriage in Israel is uncalled for. You sound like a miserable whinger.Go and live in Germany which is a sane civilized free choice enlightened country. Ask some of the Holocaust survivors living in Israel how wonderful Germany is ....GOOD RIDDANCE......
40. You and your ilk try your best to destroy our
olim hadashim ,   tel aviv/israel   (02.20.13)
Jewish values and culture.But you will not succeed.
41. #39
Northern   (02.20.13)
Dany, why do you hold Israel to the standards of Egypt and Iran? Why can't we hold ourselves to the standards of Switzerland and the US? Americans and the Swiss are human beings, just like us. They can, why can't we? Sure, Israel is a great democracy compared to each and every other middle eastern country, but holding yourself up to the democratic standards of Saudi Arabia is like going to a math competition in a preschool, and then bragging about winning. I believe in this country. That's why I want to be able to say that we're no worse a democracy than Switzerland and Norway. Not just Iran and Syria.
42. # 14
Mike Carmel ,   Rishon le Zion   (02.20.13)
It's a religion. Period. Nothing else. The fact that you can "convert" into it proves that it isn't a race, or a nation.
43. Civil Unions at New Family Organization
Danya Cohen ,   Pardes Hanna   (02.20.13)
New Family Organization offers recognized civil unions through Contractual Marriage, Domestic Union Cards and other legal agreements. These endow couples like the author with rights and status equal to married couples!
44. To all TB-ers saying, "It's a Jewish country!"
Vered, Israel   (02.20.13)
Why do you feel the only way Judaism can survive is to force people into only one choice? Yes, there is a high intermarriage rate in all democracies, but that is not because the Orthodox are not in control, it is because what has become of Judaism does not fulfill the quest of the majority of seekers. Judaism has always been allowed to evolve with the times, until the fearful reaction to Reform in the recent past. Now the mentality is, "circle the wagons, shun, threaten, demand". It'll never work. The majority has always run away from Orthodoxy whenever they had the chance, but that doesn't mean they aren't Jews. We are now back in our own country, and we don't want the Orthodox to be in charge of marriage for everyone (unless the couple so chooses). Judaism has a lot to offer. But we must be free to accept the offer, or it means nothing.
45. 40 Ultra-Orthodox Haredi medievalism are NOT "Jewish values"
kippah seruga ,   Israel   (02.20.13)
46. Do us all a favor and go to Germany.
Yoav Naor ,   Israel   (02.20.13)
And stop complaining just about everything,Israel is a free and wonderful country and you can leave anytime that you want.There are planes leaving from BG airport daily do us a favor and hop on one of them.Good Bye.Don't slam the door on your way out.
47. Civil marriages.
Luiz F Haddad ,   Niteroi, Brazil   (02.21.13)
As a true friend of yours, I deplore the refered situation. Israel, in fact, must ever be a Jewish State, but not "only Jewish". Beyond it, there are many "secular" men and women, who don't want their union under religious rules. Lebanon, not a good example, does not have, either, civil marriages, but through Christian and Islamic rites. In Brazil, civil marriage exists since 1889, when monarchy was abolished; and religious ones, including celebrated by Rabbis, can be registered. The both forms may be valid, and it is better for Democracy. Think more about it, dear brothers and sisters.
48. Orthodox stranglehold
Sam ,   Boston, MA   (02.21.13)
Problem is not just for couples where one is non-Jewish. Only certain denominations of Judaism are allowed to perform recognized marriages within Israel. This is unacceptable. There are many interpretations of the Torah even amongst the Orthodox and to think that any one group understands it better than the other is heretical. There is no reason one group should be given the right to decide which marriages are "Jewish" and which are not.
49. #2 & #3 Jews are a nation - not a religious cult
Jewish guy ,   Israel   (02.22.13)
Yes. Israel is a Jewish state. Just like France is a French state. We can be a proud country of the Jewish people - nothing to do with any religion. Israel's right of return is not based on any religious laws, just like Nazis never cared what religion the Jews they killed practiced. Why do we have to look like some of our sharia neighbors?!
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