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Peres, Netanyahu reject idea of bi-national state
Noam (Dabul) Dvir
Published: 27.06.13, 12:43
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34 Talkbacks for this article
1. Autonomy is the only option
Scott ,   Ramat Gan, Israel   (06.27.13)
There are already 2 palestinian states - Hamastan & Jordan. There can never be territorial continuity & Israel cannot survive along 1967 borders.
2. Isn't the president a ceremonial position?
frank ,   rehovot   (06.27.13)
so why is that old man saying anything? In fact, why is he even involved? The time has come for him either to keep his mouth shut, get back into the knesset where he can open his big mouth or simply retire. I think he has put the country through enough already....
3. Peres is making his living off "Peace", Bibi just tags along
tom ,   tel aviv   (06.27.13)
4. Sounds like depression ?
Passerby ,   NL   (06.27.13)
At least i cannot see rationality in that line of thinking. More countries had a bad episode in their standing and i can hardly remember a case that did not improve, after a drastic change in policies or regimes. Argentina, Chili and Spain among others had fascist dictatorships, South Africa apartheid and my country Holland was quickly becoming a pariah state in the fifties (including UN security counsel resolutions), when it tried to hold on to the colonies by force. It wasn't something U-turning did not solve.. although it wasn't an easy process for the people most effected. I don't see a logical reason to believe Israels standing would not improve after letting go of internationally highly controversial policies.
5. One nation, An Israeli nation
(06.27.13)
If Bibi doesn't want a bi national state, then he has to claim that Israel is one nation-state. An ISRAELI nation. Cancel demoninations like JEWS or ARABS. One nation = ISRAELIS But lately politicians claim israel should be a JEWISH state, meaning that other big minorities can not be part of this Israeli nation. So then the question of what Israel wants to be pops out. Does she want to be an examplary democracy of one nation state or an apartheid state where only an ethnical part of it would be recognized as the nation?
6. #2 frank , rehovot - President Peres
Son Of Cyrus ,   UK   (06.27.13)
Hi Frank, A lot of bloggers, including your good self keep asking the same question and always criticize Mr Peres. However, the reality is that in other countries globally he is a well known name and face. He is good for public relations which is what his ceremonial position is all about and good publicity for Israel as one cannot always be portrayed as speaking about making wars and defending one self which is what the actual reality on the ground is.
7. Don't want bi-national state?Don't annex the territory.
Sam ,   Canada   (06.27.13)
So long as Israel doesn't give Palestinians citizenship there is no bi-national state.The Palestinians don't like the status quo but why should Israel care when the only Palestinian goal is for Israel to disappear. Israel is committed to a 2 state solution which Palestinians reject unless it's 2 Palestinian states. If the US,UN,EU etc are unhappy with the situation they should direct themselves to the Palestinians who reject peace because they want it all. Israel has nothing to be apologetic about.
8. SOME FORGOTTEN DETAILS.....
FO ,   Belgium   (06.27.13)
Speaking at the memorial of Herzl. President Peres said: "Herzl was right when he said that a Jewish state was absolutely necessary" Should we remind Peres that after World War I, his party disowned Herzl's program based on the creation of a Jewish state? Perhaps Peres forgot (because of his old age) that one of the main leaders of his party, Nahum Sokolow published in 1919 a History of Zionism (1600-1918) and wrote in his introduction the following: "It has been said and is still being obstinately repeated by anti-Zionists again and again, that Zionism aims at the creation of an independent Jewish State. But this is wholly fallacious. The Jewish State was never part of the Zionist programme. The Jewish State was the title of Herzl's first pamphlet, which had the supreme merit of forcing people to think". Sokolow assumed the chairmanship of all the Zionist Congresses from 1921 till his death and became President of the World Zionist Organization from 1931 till 1936. (Hitler came to power in 1933!) So the League of Nations decision (1922) to offer the Jews an embryo of a State that could have been born before the Second World War was rejected by the Left majority of the Zionist Movement, and we all know the consequences of it.
9. Bi-National States
Arie ,   Israel   (06.27.13)
We shell have a Bi-National States, whether we like or not.
10. Israeli policies state the opposite
Rami of Nazareth ,   Israel   (06.27.13)
If you do not want a bi-national state then you stop building settlements in the middle of Palestinian population centers. You move towards separation from Palestinians. Facts on the ground states the opposite.
11. Hold on to Colonies by Force?
karmel usa   (06.27.13)
I object to comment #4 portraying Israel as colonizers. How is it colonial to settle in your ancient homeland? Sadly, this well-marketed narrative seems to prevail in many corners of the world. Let's just see what the Jordan Hashemites (truly colonizers) do when their inevitable Day of Reckoning arrives and they are forced to deal with their Palestinian Arab majority.
12. Israel Belongs to GOD
Tova ,   Canada   (06.27.13)
Herzl dreamed of a Homeland for Jews in truth belongs to GOD. Herzl was a pioneer. He saw what was coming to Jews in Europe. Peres is selling Israel by destroying what GOD has put in placed. 2 state solution will never happen.
13. Defamatory accusations
David ,   Montreal, Canada   (06.27.13)
This defamation plague should of been dealt with since the beginning. Yes there is no need in justifying ourselves through the medias and help them sell their junk. But when proven wrong, we should make them pay for the damages. I'm sure they will check twice their sources before publishing.
14. #7 Ignorance is Bliss
Tambour ,   Eilat   (06.27.13)
Annex C ; Declare it a No growth Reserve. demilitarise a, b, Give underground access to Gaza for a, b, c :contiguous Supply water and jobs. Excise hatred in education. That is as far as we should go unless we are intent on Patricide
15. #14 question on Area C
Bill Stein ,   USA   (06.27.13)
You said no growth area for Area C I assume you mean no growth for the Palestians still there not Jewish towns that need to build? Also some Unpopulated and low Areas of B to straighten out Israeli Border and no land exchange. No to underground tunnel unless to Gaza unless there is no land exchange and only if it remains Israeli Soverignty. Any Arabs in annexed areas should not be made Israeli citizens but should be considered permanent residents with PA citizenship no to surrendering any part of Jerusalem to the Pales.
16. # 12 Tova, If I may
BUILD BABY BUILD!!!! ,   United States   (06.27.13)
G-d kept His promise and gave Israel ( Jacob ) and his heirs the land of Israel. There will never be a two state, bi national state of Israel, as we all know, Israel is the "Homeland for The Jewish People." What may be added is, by the grace and Promise of G-d as we also know our G-d says that He dwells in Zion KEEP BUILDING !!
17. Soon, Very soon
Dror ,   Haifa Israel   (06.27.13)
Palis will not have room to breath in Judea/Samaria. THere will be such a flood of Jews coming into the country that the Palis will want to move to Jordan where there is plenty of land. Soon the Hashemite Saudian King will have to run for his life. Anarchy will prevail in Jordan. Palis love anarchy. Perfect opportunity for squatting on land that is not yours.
18. #11 Hold your guns
Passerby ,   NL   (06.27.13)
Actually in this case it is a coincidental example (good thing we were never a fascist dictatorship - the suggestion is entirely yours, if i would have made comparisons i had done it in a different way.. well, sensitivities..). Actually i gave another statement i made some further thought and realized there is a well known model in psychology describing 5 stages of grief (Kübler-Ross model). Depression is the 4th stage, after 'denial', 'anger' and 'bargaining'. Depression is followed by 'accepting'. It might be somewhat speculative, but as an optimist i might get some hope your PM Netanyahu could be a few stages ahead, as somebody in his position ideally should be leading his people. It would be a lot to wish for, but perhaps there will be acceptance after and hopefully success in persuading people to follow his path if my careful (or more or less accidental) analysis would be right.
19. #9 care to wager on that, Arie?
BUILD BABY BUILD!!!! ,   United States   (06.27.13)
How much are you willing to bet? Your life? KEEP BUILDING !!!!!
20. No negotiations with the racist entity !!
Don Rosenberg ,   Palatine USA   (06.27.13)
Stop all talks with these racist, fake people. Israel should never have recognized a 2 state solution when they have a country called jordan. Now is the time to say NO NO NO. If these fake people want to live in peace on Israeli land fine, if not, throw the bastasds OUT !!!
21. #14 Q area C clarified
Norbus ,   JERUSALEM   (06.27.13)
no growth, means tiny 2% maximum increases allowed in population. Arab or Jew. They need income so I would lease C for 125 years . Adjustment to border for sure, equitably, even though all Judah & Shomron ours by heritage and conquest.. WE have been forced to concede by Britain, Europe and other anti Semites who never changed. Now with Obama and Russia on our border we need a slight compromise Tunnell remains Israeli land with a right of way to Pals so long as no hostility . Demilitarise GAZA if possible . Reward & encourage Emigration to countries of origin. Claim set off for Jews from Middle East dispossessed
22. Reply to Mr. Passerby
karmel usa   (06.27.13)
Since I'm not a psycholgist, could you please restate your comments in plain, straightforward English? I assume you have a message to convey, but it's hidden amongst a lot of high falootin' psycho-babble. You may be a genius, but your communication skills need to come down to earth.
23. #21 NO WAY
Bill Stein ,   USA   (06.27.13)
No Lease Only Annex Permanently forget it. I will never accept it and I know most Israelis will never accept it. Israel must Annex Area C Permanently not lease and there is no capitulation to the rest of the world. Forget it
24. leader
john ,   toronto   (06.27.13)
A leader should have a vision and it should not change according to times.
25. Peres, good for Public Relations?
ASTRONAUT ,   SC, USA   (06.27.13)
Dear Cyrus - look where "public relations" got the Jews in 1939.
26. It's not the country, IT'S THE GOVERNMENT...
Gunnar ,   Gothenburg, Sweden   (06.27.13)
...that recieves low scores in international surveys. That's quite different! On the contrary, in survey after survey, Israel is actually one of the most admired countries in the world. Not that facts or reality have ever stopped Bibi Netanyahu from lying.
27. the problem is democracy v ideology
zionist forever   (06.27.13)
in Israel we got to many parties in the government all with different ideologies and even in the parties themselves not all members agree and there are some that are more radical in their values than others. Then there is the problem with coaliton government, sometimes to form governments parties with totally different ideologies are needed if a coalition is going to be formed. Result is in Israel different parties wan't different things and government has to find a balancing act to try keep all members of the coalition happy and to add to the problem we got outside pressure from the US. The palestinians just say we demand all the land captured in 1967 along with East Jerusalem and a right of return now you accept all our demands in full or we walk. The west also love the palestinians, they are the underdog and everybody always loves the underdog so the palestinians see no reason to even consider budging even 1 inch on their demands if they have just about the whole western world on their side. Our politicians are weak and are willing to cross red line after red line so Abbas is happy enough to drag things out then just say Israel is not interested in peace so 2 state idea is dead we now plan to push for a single state which is what both the PLO & Hamas have always wanted. Its also the solution the rest of the world ( US included ) want they have but its never been pushed because its to politically risky so we got 2 state idea but if the atmosphere is right even the US will start demanding a single state to replace Israel. When it comes to international politics democracy can end up putting you on the loosing side.
28. Passerby # 4- keep on walking because
Arnold ,   Montreal-Canada   (06.27.13)
you have no concept of the situation. First off all the countries you mentioned might have been controlled by facist dictators but each was of Christian background and therefore Christian ethics no matter how mean the dictators were. Secondly they were not surrounded by foes. Israel is surrounded by foes whose majority are moslem with a dislike and chip on their shoulders in reference to Israel and Jews in general. This is a known fact. Israel needs and demands security from these foes because bottom line even with an agreement they will be coming to attack when they feel it is in their power. All we are seeing from all these people is a hudna. Go look it up in the dictionary.
29. One Jewish State!!
manicdrummer ,   Haifa, Israel   (06.27.13)
This is God's land. He and He alone will determine who will rightfully live here.
30.  # 29 manicdrummer
BUILD BABY BUILD!!!! ,   United States   (06.27.13)
He kept His promise and the heirs of Israel possess Israel again just as predicted. KEEP BUILDING !!!!
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