Opinion  Eitan Haber
Peace with Jordan invaluable
Eitan Haber
Published: 23.10.13, 20:06
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
48 Talkbacks for this article
1. Agreed
Marc   (10.23.13)
This article makes a lot of sense. While I dont agree with the way the Palestinian leadership (or Israeli) has handled the Peace Process, and there is much blame to go around, Jordan is Israel's natural ally in the region. Israel needs more regional allies and the only way to achieve this is Peace and reconstruction for all parties and the way to that is through the Palestinians.
2. If Jordan is not Palestine than what about 75% majority Pale
E.M Jordan is Pales ,   S.F   (10.23.13)
If Jordan is not Palestine than what about 75% majority Palestinian in Jordan .There is tow alternative either two Palestinian State which one is Jordan and the other one is Yehuda and Shomron but even this two alternative does not make them satisfy because they believe for destruction of State of Israel and from there to take over of Jordan and entire Jewish State in the final will be Palestinians State. So what is Israel alternative the Israel alternative is that the Jordan is Palestinian State with majority of 75%Palestinian,
3. "Jordan is not Palestine"?
Jake   (10.23.13)
Article 25 of the Palestine Mandate document disagrees with you: "In the territories lying between the Jordan and the eastern boundary of Palestine as ultimately determined, the Mandatory shall be entitled, with the consent of the Council of the League of Nations, to postpone or withhold application of such provisions of this mandate as he may consider inapplicable to the existing local conditions, and to make such provision for the administration of the territories as he may consider suitable to those conditions". Transjordan was created by Article 25 of the Palestine Mandate document, and the Transjordanian Memorandum, as that part of Palestine in which the provisions of the Jewish National Home would not be applied. In the balance of the territory, west of the Jordan, national rights are reserved exclusively for the Jews, with civil and religious (but not national) rights for non-Jews.
4. Hashemites For Partition in 1937
Zechariah   (10.23.13)
The Hashemites were for partition in 1937 enough land to save millions of Jews and create a Jewish Islamic Confederation that would now be a Superpower.So we are obligated to strengthen Hashemite Rule .
5. Peace with Jordan
Yossef Carnevale ,   Sao Paulo - Brazil   (10.23.13)
You are 100% right, Mr. Haber. Like almost human beings we will miss this priceless peace right after it is gone, but I expect this never happens.
6. Peace deals are terribly flawed
Joe Fraser   (10.23.13)
Jordan should have taken back part of the West Bank and Egypt should have taken back Gaza. All Israel has gotten because of the peace deals are never ending claims against its capital and territory.
7. But Jordan is Palestine
Bill Stein ,   USA   (10.23.13)
65 to 75 percent Palestinian ran by a Hashemite minority? Why are politicians trying to create three palesitian states out of the worlds only Jewish state is madness. Gaza West Bank Jordan? Jordan is Palestine not the West Bank Judea and Samaria
8. Poor Haber, ignores that little King won't be there forever
Steve Benassi ,   Silver Bay, MN USA   (10.23.13)
9. It's only time till Jordan will fall
annex the J. Valley   (10.23.13)
The Jordanian regime, as other dictatorships in the Middle East, will fall. This is why Israel must annex the Jordan Valley.
10. dream, then blame
todd ,   censor history,   (10.24.13)
"Every such statement, even from unimportant people who think they are important, brings closer the reconstruction of the dangerous 'eastern front,' " If you really are so afraid of what 'unimportant people' say, you clearly have no faith in peace with Jordan. One day if the Hashemites fall, you'll have your excuse ready ... "This wasnt because dictatorships are unstable, or that they still keep arabs in refugee camps! No, it was because some unimportant people whispered that Israel only has 1/3rd of historic Palestine!"
11. Age of Nuclear Exchanges
Zechariah   (10.24.13)
To protect Jews Arabs and Internationals from a psychosuical nuclear armed group a Jewish and International Force ought be massive on the Jordan Valley and other Vulnerable Areas.
12. Haber where is the geon Yaakov
Nachman   (10.24.13)
Your inferiority complex of being a Jew is amazing. You should be proud of being the chosen nation. Long after Jordan as we know it today will disintegrate and the king gone Israel will flourish.
13. Why do we need to be thankful for peace?
Daniel ,   NY   (10.24.13)
You are so kind for not killing us... What nonsense. Are we invading Jordan, are we trying to kill them? If a jew killed a jordaian would we send him to jail? So why should attack us. This is apologetic liberal nonsense that subconsciously begs the world please be nice to us. Thank you so much. May be we should become their slaves or something... What nonsense.
14. What a childish notion: even the "peace" with Egypt will
tom ,   tel aviv   (10.24.13)
falter one day and it won't be because of lack of trying on our part. The truce with Jordan is there only as long as the Mullahs permit it to continue. So please stop deluding yourself Haber (actually, you exist in a permanent delusional state) This "soul-searching" for Human Values on the part of Jews in Middle East is bringing us closer to extinction day by day.
15. To No.3
Bertram ,   London, UK   (10.24.13)
In the context of the territory west of the Jordan I would be grateful if you could explain how a non-Jew would exercise 'civil and religious' rights but not exercise 'national' rights.
16. #15 glad you asked
(10.24.13)
There are two models. The first model is how Druze, Bedouin, Circassian, Alawi or Zionist Christian or Muslim Arab citizens of Israel exercise their civil rights. The second model is how Copts exercise their civil rights under the Brotherhood in Egypt, how Sunni exercise their civil rights under Assad in Syria, or how Christians exercise their rights under PLO/Fatah.
17. peace should be the norm
rm ,   NL Amsterdam   (10.24.13)
I agree but there's no need to be arrogant about it. Once Israel realises that it's not that much better I think things will get better. The Israeli arrogant knows it best attitude is certainly not
18. we should never dismiss Peace
David ,   Israel   (10.24.13)
Jordan may not be the strongest country Israel has peace with but it certainly helps us - if not politically then atleast geographically.
19. thank you Rabin-worshipper for your opinion
Tony   (10.24.13)
Lefty-looney bollocks as usual. Now let's move on to the real world.
20. #3 Jake, WRONG
Suzy ,   NYC   (10.24.13)
Wrong. Civil Rights include political rights. Furthermore Israel was given BORDERS by the UN. Get over yourselves. Your spins are just that, dead end spins.
21. To Betram, London, UK.
David Clarke ,   Liverpool, England   (10.24.13)
Betram he, like many others on here, is repeating the whole myth that "Jordan is Palestine", the belief that the whole of mandate Palestine was given to the Jewish People and that Transjordan was created as a Palestinian State during the treaty of San Remo for Arabs on both sides of the Jordan River, this mantra is often repeated by those with an innate desire to deport the Palestinian population to Jordan and turn the Hashemite Kingdom into an alternative Palestine, rather than form a Palestinian state west of the Jordan river, as was decreed in the 1948 partition plan of mandate Palestine and is recognized as neccersary under the current peace process today. What Jake and others fail to understand is that Palestinians are the Arab people from between the Mediterranean sea and the Jordan River, they are not Jordanians and do not want to go to Jordan, neither do the Jordanians want millions of Palestinian refugees pouring over their borders, the San Remo treaty simply created the Jordanian Hashemite Kingdom for Arabs East of the Jordan river, it did not create a Palestinian State for Arabs west of the Jordan river, who, like the Jewish people, are envisaged as exercising their right to nationalSelf-determination West of the Jordan River as decreed by the UN and the vast majority of world powers.
22. Right-wing gov'ts are always seeking new enemies
Shachar ,   Eilat   (10.24.13)
The deeply ingrained paranoia that is part of the rightist DNA drives them down the road of self-fulfilling prophecies.
23. we should never dismiss Peace
David ,   Israel   (10.24.13)
Jordan may not be the strongest country Israel has peace with but it certainly helps us - if not politically then atleast geographically.
24. Jordan was Palestine until 1967
zionist forever   (10.24.13)
All these arabs who live in Judea & Samaria they didn't all arrive after 1967 they were living there prior to 1967 when Judea & Samaria was part of Jordan. If Paestine was Jordan prior to 1967 why can't Palestine be Jojrdan again? BEST SOLUTION Negotiate secretly with the Jordanians than in exchange for a huge payoff they will give all residents of Gaza, Judea & Samaria by default Jordanian citizenship. Once Jordanian citizens the PA will be dissolved. Israel will give Jordan a percentage of Judea & Samaria as a token victory but the rest is internationally recognized as being Israeli territory along with Jerusalem although we will let the Jordanian Waqf run Temple Mount on the condition its coordinated with Israeli authorities and they have equal say and there is no restrictions on Jews visiting or praying except in the mosque compound. The now Jordanians living in whats now Israeli territory will be encouraged to leave but as long as they obey the law they can continue livng there as Jordanians in Israel as long term residents. They will have no voting rights or right to say what can be built and where because they are resdents not citizens. Their children though cannot inherit their residency when they are legally adults they must apply for residency.
25. Mr. Haber, I am confused by your ambiguous article.
Israeli 2   (10.24.13)
Even the "unimportant people" in this talkback realize that if (as you yourself admit) that a vast number of Palestinians are Jordanians like a vast number of illegal Mexicans or undocumented aliens are from Mexico but live in the USA, does not make them a separate nation. If they choose to create a new country let them argue and negotiate with Mexico. They have no right to lean on the USA and demand territory from them.
26. ginsberg and oslo
milson   (10.24.13)
years ago, this ex idf expatriat convinced me that a gaza withdrawal was in insrael interests, that economic liberation would be better than military advantage as you cannot kill an idea. i cautionned him that arabs would use gaza as a launching post. Well, he was wrong. I am sure rabin if he were here, would be saying how the hell did he end up in bed with these dreamy eyed pacifists like haber, peres, beilin, ben ami. ZThey were the ones who brought in the rotten oslo egged on by clinton who like john kerry talks about lack of sustainability and really does not understand arabs.
27. 24 Gazans don't need to be Jordanians
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   www.netzarim.co.il   (10.24.13)
Gaza, old Grecian Philistia (of Hellenist Greek Philistines), has, to my knowledge, never been part of Israel. No identifiable Philistines exist today. I see no reason that Gazans shouldn't have their own country independent of Jordan or the Shomron. Excluding Gazans from Jordanian citizenship would at least partially alleviate the burden on Hashemites if Jordan were to become compassionate and grant citizenship to the "Palestinians" within their own borders and the Arabs of the Shomron. Jordan could further relieve itself of the "Palestinian" burden by insisting that all of the Arab countries incorporate "Palestinian refugees" into their respective countries. The only reason these things aren't going to happen is because of theology: Muslims want Jews and Judaism eradicated from the Middle East they bellicosely insist should be pure Muslim. It is, after all, at its core, a conflict of theology. Therefore, winning this conflict depends upon winning the polemics, which depends upon confronting Dark Ages theology (ours as well as theirs) with the reality of the modern world, science and tolerance. And Jews, trained up from birth to do the rituals, obey the rabbi and not ask questions, is completely unarmed for this war.
28. Jordan reconciliation w/its "Palestinians" no less essential
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   Israel   (10.24.13)
29. #3 a small correction
On the Balcony   (10.24.13)
You are correct about Article 25 (which lays to rest the claim that Israel was robbed of 77% of its intended territory. ) You are however wrong in stating that national rights were reserved exclusively for Jews. The idea was that both Jews and non-Jews would preserve their own cultural identities within the context of a shared national identity. Weizman himself acknowleged and approved of this. And that is why the Mandate authorities issued Palestinian Passports to BOTH Jews and Arabs. Read the mandate again more carefully.
30. Bible, physics: In the beginning was the Mandate? LOL
Cyberbrain ,   Israel   (10.24.13)
Next talkbacks
Back to article