And no one is forcing you to not get married by a haredi rabbi who interferes in your personal choices, just asking not to have it imposed on people who don't want it.

and has no place whatsoever in the public sphere. That, can you get it??

guys, i do agree with Yakir. We are in 21st century, discrimination is a crime. I don't think we can say that Israel is a western country, because you have different culture and different way of thinking almost similar to us in the middle east, you are more passionate than reasonable towards any matter and your comments prove this theory. I thought Lebanon have sex and religion discrimination but it seems you are way behind us. If you wanna say that Israel is a Jewish country you are not allowed to talk anymore about the freedom of speech and freedom of thought, moreover you can't accuse anyone anymore with the Antisemitism because you are refusing everybody (with all respect to Judaism as a religion). what differs you from the Nazi nationalism if you keep saying that you are the chosen and Israel is for Jews.

B"H - "And what will the rest of the people do, including homosexuals, lesbians, atheists or those without any religious affiliation – who are all, by the way, law-abiding and tax-paying citizens?" - Elkariv asks. "They can take care of themselves" - he suggests and let me add, outside of the country! They can vote with their feet! For an explanation of this, what you would call "extremist" opinion, let me offer this: The Zionist State was established on what for the Jews is Eretz Israel. This creates a double, no, not truth, because there is only One Truth, Torah, but a double reality, let's say. For the Zionists, post-Zionists, etc. the law is the civil law of the land. For the Jews, Torah is the Law. So Yakir, Elkariv, you can push for civil marriage, gay rights, etc. in Israel, but know that you're up against precisely that mysterious force that kept the Jews alive in the past 2000 years, against all odds. You are up against G-d's Law and by doing so politically you position yourself in the anti-Jewish camp: Not a nice place, not on the Land of Israel!

The fact that Family matters such as Marriage and Divorce are in the hands of religious courts in Israel is from the remenants that were adopted from the British Mandate, who in turn did not change this from the Ottaman Empire. During this period it was a common form of governing that people dealt with these laws according to their religious affiliations and that general criminal laws...ect were run by the Islamic law system at the time. Only the prior was removed during the British Mandate leaving Family Affairs under the laws of appropriate religious affiliation. This system was continued into modern Israel. So, to answer the question, yes all religions can get married in Israel however they must do so in accordance with the courts of their religious affiliation and laws. This obviously creates problems even beyond secular and gay marriage possibilities where when a muslim man is to wed a jewish woman face the question of which courts to get married under? As, according to Islam the faith is determined by the man and in Judaism a woman :) Larry at #15, seriously? You want to preach these morals and LA is your 'City & Country'

Why does the author want to bother living in a Jewish state just so he can marry some shiksa and have a bunch of goy kids anyway? He could move to chu"l to do that much more easily

If, as the author states, couples can live together without being married in the state's eyes, "without lacking a single thing. On the contrary", then what's the need for civil unions?

If homosexuality is against nature, then why it's a behavior widely found in the nature itself?? The only place where homosexuality is against nature is in your mind and in your pseudo holy shmoly book... written by the hand of men themselves.

Israel is in no way even remotely similar to a democracy. It never was, even for one fleeting moment in its history. Ben Gurion was a dictator, installed and kept in place by brainwashed people with little red booklets. I could list 20 or more reasons why Israel cannot be designated as a democracy, religious coercion and domination of people's lives is at the top of the list. The indiscriminate blocking of a person's bank account for a civil private debt such as not paying a TV license and even the issuing of a warrant denying leave of exit are disgusting occurrencies which impinge on personal freedom and are not compatible with the values contained within the word and concept known as democracy. The canard, "Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East", is a lie perpetrated for a populace with very feeble minds. Discrimination and separation are rife in every sector of society and democracy is a value not fully understood by most people. The ballot box is the first step, only the first, israel is lacking in all the rest.

And if there was a constitution it would be in the Basic Law for human freedoms. But in Israbluff everything is for sale including personal freedoms. And it is secular politicians selling off these freedoms to get religious votes for their coalition. We seculars can only blame ourselves for this mess!

"I thought Lebanon have sex and religion discrimination but it seems you are way behind us" - Well answer me these questions, Maroun. How many gay parades has been held in Lebanon until today? How many openly-gay politicians do you have? What percentage of the senior managers and business-people in your economy, are women? "If you wanna say that Israel is a Jewish country you are not allowed to talk anymore about the freedom of speech and freedom of thought" - No freedom of speech in Israel? No freedom of THOUGHT in Israel? Really? Then what do you call all of the Arab MKs who routinely incite against Israel, and nothing happens to them? And tell me, what will happen to me, if I come to Lebanon and waved the Israeli flag? Will this form of freedom of speech be respected? "you can't accuse anyone anymore with the Antisemitism because you are refusing everybody" - Say WHAT? "what differs you from the Nazi nationalism if you keep saying that you are the chosen and Israel is for Jews" - Ehmmm... The fact that we don't wish to KILL other people who are different than us? The fact that we are satisfied with a tiny piece of land, and don't wish to expand and rule the entire world? The fact that we want peaceful relations with all of our neighbors? The fact that the only thing we really want - is to be left alone?

So many marriages end up in divorce, or one (or both) spouses cheating on each other, or simply lose the passion and love and stay together only for the children. Not to mention the expenses of an average wedding ceremony in Israel - about 150000 shekels. Why not just live together with the one you love, for as long as possible and desired for both of you? I really don't understand the big deal here. Why do gays, non-Jews insist to partake in this redundant ceremony? The only real advantage marriage has these days is for tax purposes, but I believe even that can be arranged when you live with a partner ("yeduim ba-tzibur").

Please don't feel offended and i think you don't have to be offensive. At least we are discussing matters (regardless if we agree between us) and not holding arms at borders. let me answer your question: - I will agree with you about the gay matter, which is till now not totally accepted matter in our society due to religion thoughts "God created man and woman". i believe it is the same in Israel. but i will agree with you about woman, i had three women bosses during my career (i am a mechanical engineer holding a managerial position). believe me the woman is equal to man when it comes to economy and business. In Lebanon we almost broke the taboo of marriage between different religions and thats why i said u r far behind. i wasn't expecting that in Israel you have such matter. Indeed, you can't say that Israel is Jewish and talk about freedom because simply in a Jewish state the Jews have more privileges than others (like Saudi Arabia for Muslims). Then what you call the act of differing people because of their religion thoughts (unless you truly believe that God is on your side and you are the people of God). when i asked about the difference with the Nazi i didn't mean in their action but in their way of thinking (all nationalism have the same approach). I wish one day you can come to Lebanon and i can go to Israel. I want to be fair with you, an Israeli can't write in a Lebanese website like am doing here (sometimes Ynet are not publishing my comments but that's fine also)

Mamzer is not a child that is born outside of marriage. Mamzer is a child born out of adultury by the mother or from incest. Also from forbiden marriges - as from mother who is divorcee and the father who is Cohen. Also mamzer can be produces only by two Jews. Children who are born to parents where one is Jew and the other one not cannot be mamzer.

a child with one man,and than has a child with an other man,the second child is a mamzer,if i am not wrong.Because not being married,she could not get a get of her first partner,

I did not mean to sound too offensive, it's just that I felt a need to put your statements in the correct light. But I am actually quite happy to engage in a debate with you - I completely agree with you that it's way better than aiming guns at each other across the border. Maybe you do not know enough about Israel and that's why you wrote what you did, and I sure do not know enough about Lebanon too. Of course I will be happy to visit one day and also to welcome you to my country. I just hope this day will come not too far in the future, and we will both be alive to experience it. By the way, ynet sometimes filters my comments too, so the site has nothing personal against you ;) And yes I agree that Jews traditionally see themselves as "chosen" but so do all religions, no? Islam considers all other religions as sinful heretics, Christianity says everyone who does not accept Jesus will go to hell... But unlike Islam and Christianity, at least Judaism does not try to convert the whole world and will not kill you if you refuse to become Jewish... Personally as an atheist of Jewish descent I don't care much for religion and certainly don't see myself as "chosen", if anything I see Judaism is a big burden. Antisemitism is always there, sometimes it feels the whole world is against us. And we're pretty bad in sports! And our dark semetic genes are not too amazing, as far as looks are concerned, and could certainly use some boost from the outside. But I still embrace my origin and live with it proudly. Hey, no one can take away all those Nobel prizes we won! Anyways... Take care, I look forward to seeing you more in here.

Nor is Haredi law "mysterious force that kept the Jews alive in the past 2000 years." Nor is Haredi Law "G-d's Law" And there is NOTHING "anti-Jewish" about opposing Haredi extremism, hypocrisy and arrogance. Such abuses are CONTRA-Torah. On the contrary, opposing wrongs are consummately Jewish AND Scriptural (Torah) -- especially when the wrong-doers are among us.

Marriage is not a human right. Marriage is an institution. In Israel it is a religious institution (as it should be everywhere) not a civil institution. That is why Jews are married by the Rabbinate, according to Jewish law, and Muslims are married by the Waqf. True marriage exists within the context of religion. Outside of that its just two people signing a contract, which no one is stopping them from doing.

You both seem confused about the concept of Jews being a chosen people. It does not mean we are better, or superior, or seek to impose ourselves on others. It simply means that we believe God chose us to follow and spread His word (at Mt. Sinai 3800+ years ago). There is no comparison between Nazi ideology and Jewish theology, although I don't blame Maroun for falling victim to Nazi propaganda, which is rampant in Arab countries.

Surely you don't agree with the author who supports gay marriage and intermarriage? If so, that kippa seruga on your head is what, a fashion statement?

Pure nonsense? You are clearly here referring to your own words. What an insult to those who have had civil marriage ceremonies in countries outside Israel. Given your authoritarian impulses you would rather it was not the case, but civil marriage is an institution every bit as authentice as religious marriage. The only difference is that no deity is invoked to sanction it. However, if it is 'just two people signing a contract' it is a significant improvement on the ketubah where only one person - the man- signs the contract.

because if the marriage is not valid according to Jewish law , if the spouses separate and go living with others, the children of the new couples would not be mamzerim

The last sentence of my previous post should be deleted since it may not be an accurate statement.

Marriage is a religious institution in Israel. The State of Israel doesn't marry anyone so don't claim there is discrimination at the state level. A rabbi & two witnesses marry Jews in Israel, the same as every other country, the same as every Jewish marriage for over 2000 years. The state recognizes those marriages, along with Islamic and Christian marriages, and civil marriages performed in other countries. There is no discrimination. For the record, I don't necessarily oppose civil marriage in Israel. I think there are many benefits for religious and seculars alike. But I detest reading hyperbole from authors like Yakir who accuse Israel of not being a democracy because Israel doesn't have civil marriage. Being a Democracy doesn't hinge on whether a state has civil marriage.

Civil marriage is a very important component of one of the most important values contained within the concept and meaning of the word democracy. Democracy is not a word that can be used to denote a country which does not uphold freedom of choice in all matters pertaining to the individual. For me there are three legal documents written in statute law of three different countries. The British Magna Carta, The American Constitution and the French Rights of Man, to these I add The Gettysburg Address. All the rest is bunkum.

before checking it.

If you need the security of marriage, draw up a civil contract of co-habitation. It has the same meaning and you can build in easy termination clause, or whatever you wish.

A majority of Western countries and many states in the US do not recognize homosexual marriage. Look it up on Wikepedia. Wether you are for or against, making up lies to single out Israel is wrong.