Jewish Scene
Rabbi: Woman's sermon is blasphemy
Kobi Nachshoni
Published: 26.11.13, 15:19
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1. A light on the nations...
(11.26.13)
2. No word about the content of the woman's sermon, just looks
Abe Froman ,   NY, NY   (11.26.13)
3. Another Headline Distortion
TSB ,   Clifton, NJ USA   (11.26.13)
Yet again, the headline grossly distorts what was said. First of all, all the rabbi forbade was a sermon in the middle of prayer. Gender separation at Jewish prayer services is a long established halacha, and having a woman cross over during prayers is clearly not allowed. Nothing he said, however, would bar a lecture by a woman that is separate from the prayer service. That happens quite a lot, in fact. (It would be interesting to know whether he would permit a woman giving a sermon from behind a mechitzah.) Second, the "blasphemy" statement was said in specific to immodestly dressed women standing before the entire congregation. And he is right -- a woman giving a sermon in a synagogue while showing her cleavage is grossly disrespectful. (What I don't see answered here is whether you need a sermon at all. You don't, and most shuls in Israel do not.)
4. Welcome to the 12th century
Eric ,   Tel Aviv & NYC   (11.26.13)
In the real world they understand that the Torah does not prohibit women from study, prayer, or other religious observances; just that the women are exempted from the requirements to do them. But real people know that an exemption is not the same as a prohibition.
5. many dati leumi are weak religiously
david ,   new york   (11.26.13)
the dati leumi are all nominally orthodox, but they are not used to standing up for yidishkeit as we are in the U.S. many "go with the flow" and wont object to anything. i went to a synagogue here in new york. one shabbos the rabbi got up and thanked the local reform rabbi for "20 years of service to the community". i walked out and that was the last time i ever set foot in that synagogue. why do i need to go to a synagogue that is LESS religious than me, where i have to be worried whether the rabbi is religiously acceptable or not? do you go to a synagogue for food and chatter or are you going there to grow jewishly?
6. Women taking a positive role in synagogues -- shocking!
Alan - Mérida ,   Merida, Yucatan, Mex   (11.26.13)
Yes, women should be hidden in little backrooms behind the men, or stuck overhead in the peanut gallery. Why, the mere presence of a woman before the male congregants is horrifying, as "the public is not permitted to swallow the pride and dignity of the Torah." Silly me, I had thought the Torah was for all. I had even been of the thought that a learned woman discoursing on the parasha of the week further elevated our respect for the Torah. Fortunately, this rabbi emerged from his dark cave to provide me with proper guidance! And Tzohar is supposed to be more understanding of our people than the so-called gedolim of the parasitic Charedi!
7. Well, he is right...
Ari ,   Haifa   (11.26.13)
8. Another nutter
Eric ,   Tel-Aviv, Israel   (11.26.13)
So many "nutter rabbis" in Israel, so backward and primitive. And to think that they are on the public payroll, its absurd and obscene.
9. Can Tora see women? Or can you hide women from the Creator?
Non-KoolAid Drinker ,   DrinkyurownKoolAid   (11.26.13)
10. Yet, but women tax payers must pay his salary!
aviv benedix ,   jerusalem   (11.27.13)
Another reason why we must separate religion and state!
11. He is just making this up = can't prove it
John ,   NZ   (11.26.13)
12. #5 David
JDE ,   Boston, USA   (11.26.13)
"do you go to a synagogue for food and chatter or are you going there to grow jewishly?" So, being erliche toward a colleague with whom one disagrees displays a failure to grow Jewishly? You were right to walk out of that synagogue. They're better off without you.
13. Oh the horror of listening to a woman!
Carl ,   USA   (11.27.13)
How humiliating that a man is so poorly educated that a mere woman might provide him with insight into Torah. What a sad statement on that man's yeshiva and all his (male) teachers that they collectively failed to imbue sufficient knowledge and wisdom. Rather than simply leaving the synagogue, the "esteemed rabbi" should have advised the man to gouge out his eyes once they were so contaminated by the sight of a woman on the bimah and seek out a lobotomy to remove the affected portion of his brain. Yes, we Jews have a long history with blasphemy going back at least to the Inquisition - we certainly want to maintain our purity, just like our pious Islamic friends. And what is more blasphemous than a learned woman who dares to engage with her genetic superiors? Someone please bring these antiquated rabbis to the 21st century already...
14. As usual Ashkenazim create all religious problems.
S Judah ,   Jerusalem   (11.26.13)
Just does not happen in the Sephardi/Mizrahi community. We don't split by reforms/liberals/conservatives/ modern, normal,super , ultra and extra super orthodox, nor haredi or women of the wall. All these groups are horrible and disgusting splits of the ashkenazi community. Of course we have many other faults, but with religious matters the secular religious divide is blured with the Sephardim and we are better for it. Our women spend their time making fabulous food and ruling their household and don't suffer from the inferiority complex that needs public showing off.
15. Rabbi Ariel
h.s.cohen ,   N.Y.C. U.S.A.   (11.27.13)
Tell the good Rabbi : Stop being such a pain.
16. #10 Avi - AMEN
Hila ,   Ramat Gan Resident   (11.27.13)
Yes you are 100% correct its my annona that is paying for this nut case to spread his hate sermons. Dosent mind living off my hard earnt money, but heaven forbid that us womeni should have a voice. If he thinks women are here on earth to cook dinner, wash their underwear and raise 12 kids, then he had better think again. Last time i checked it was 2013 not 1003. Then they think they can tell us how to dress, ranting on about modesty and the size of our clevage. What about their modesty, the size of his under carriage altghoug in his case i doubt if thats an issue.
17. Overdose of Rabbis
Ronnie ,   Hod Hasharon   (11.27.13)
With the examples we see if criminals like Rabbi Metzker, Rabbi Deri and a few more who use mafia tactics to get the mayor elected, I would not take seriously what Rabbi's have to say on halacha.
18. A prostitute in "work clothes" goes into a beit k'nesset...
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   netzarim.co.il   (11.27.13)
I wouldn't know in the men's section until later, at which time I would try to make her feel welcome and see how rewarding and fulfilling Torah is in one's life. Even before that, I'm sure my wife, seeing her enter the women's section when she arrived, would do the same. And I'm just as sure that wouldn't be popular with the rabbis and some "frummer than thou" members. But, then, we didn't choose this life to be popular or I'd still be a Baptist preacher living much more comfortably in the U.S. We gave up everything to serve ha-Sheim according to Tanakh and logical Halakhah, not to devolve to the Dark Ages, wear costumes and become zombies worshiping rabbi-intermediaries presuming to overrule the Creator. The flock, Israel, belongs to ha-Sheim, NOT to the rabbis. Rabbis who drive away HIS sheep are either ravenous wolves in sheep's clothing (where have I heard that before?) or רֹעִי הָאֱלִיל -- the idolatrous shepherds of a feckless-deity prophesied by the Neviyim (Yeshayahu 19.1; Yekhezqeil 34; Yirmeyahu 10.21; 23.1-8; 3.15; Zekharyah 11.16-17) -- along with their fate.
19. Ladies' Divrei Torah
Akiva ,   NYC   (11.27.13)
After the main service either before or after Kiddush a woman can deliver a Devar Torah in the hall. Although it's our custom that ladies do not lain, in couples minyanim where some ladies do lain, they do so from the ladies side of the mechitza.
20. Reply to 3 Sermons
Sherlock Holmes ,   London England   (11.27.13)
Here in England Haredi Rabbonim give full length sermons only on Shabbos Shuva and Shabbos HaGadol. The weekly Rabbi's sermon was largely an American Reform imitation of the Protestant churches, as was mixed seating. Rabbis can address Bar Mitzvah boys at their seudah and address their chasonim under the chupa or at the seudas mitzvah. A sermon may suit once a week shul goers, but not shuls where the men attend seven days a week.
21. Women and aliyahs
Danny ,   London England   (11.27.13)
In earlier times whomever was called up to the Torah lained his portion. When times deteriorated and many men could not lain it became the custom to appoint a baal ko're to lain. As the mitzvah of learning Torah applies more to men the baal ko're appointed was preferably a man. He alludes to this in the last sentence, 'the dignity of Torah' requires a man to lain because a man has the main mitzva of learning Torah.
22. Please read carefully!
Yossi ,   Baltimore   (11.27.13)
Many men attend a Daf Yomi shiur BEFORE Shacharis. Many stay for a Devar Torah AFTER davvening. Rabbi Ariel only objected to a woman speaking in the MIDDLE of services. Let women give an optional Devar Torah before or after davvening. The blasphemy refers to a married woman speaking in shul in front of the Aron Kodesh bareheaded or with her cleavage partly visible.
23. 18 , you aree STILL a baptist preacher
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (11.27.13)
No TRUE Orthodox rabbi acknowledged your self proclaimed "conversion"
24. Evolve or Dissolve
Yakov ,   Tel Aviv   (11.27.13)
First, misogyny is a sin. Second, ignoring the positive impact that Women have made to Judaism, is another sin. Thirdly, teaching youth, that Women can work, fight and pay taxes, but are not good enough to be equals in the Shul, is shameful. The more the Charedi community distances itself from reality, the harder it will be for it to survive. Closed communities, fear and coercion are not long-term solutions for survival. Evolve or eventually dissolve!
25. 23 Charles still same old ignorant slanderer
Paqid Yirmeyahu ,   www.netzarim.co.il   (11.27.13)
slandering, as well, the Orthodox rabbis who converted me I don't think anyone pays attention to your rantings about me. I sure don't. I imagine most will pull up short of slandering the Orthodox rabbis who converted me.
26. No different than Islam!
(11.27.13)
27. No. 18
TSB ,   Clifton, NJ USA   (11.27.13)
Maybe read the article again. He is not talking about a woman who came into shul and sat in the women's section. He is talking about a woman, immodestly clad, who crossed over to the men's section, stood in front of the ark, and gave a sermon to a captive audience, men and women. Quite a difference.
28. #23 Charles - Shame on your lahon hara
Carl ,   USA   (11.27.13)
What gives you authority to belittle a man's conversion into our faith? He said nothing to warrant questioning his motivation or conversion process, nor those of the rabbi who taught him.
29. #28
Jew ,   Jerusalem   (11.29.13)
He warranted more than questioning, he warranted dismissal. He mocked the entire rabbinical system which is an historically christian position/attitude. He then went on to preach verses which he can't read or understand properly without the rabbinical history, another christian approach.
30. #12 - you're a little confused
david ,   new york   (11.29.13)
its fine to be personally nice to a reform rabbi or a catholic priest or even a jew for jesus. however, it is not acceptable to announce in synagugue about his "wonderful service", when in fact it goes against everything yidishkeit stands for and when they are destroying jews by the thousands on a daily basis. sorry, i am friends with everyone, but that doesnt mean i have to accept what they do.
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