Opinion
Secular people will never get it
Liron Nagler-Cohen
Published: 19.11.18, 15:35
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1. Shabbat mitsvah
Maurice Rosenfeld ,   Antwerp   (11.19.18)
Nobody forces religious people to believe in myths and make a fuss about shabbat "desecration". They are either ignorant or gullible to let themselves be guided by irrelevant beliefs.
2. Correct analysis
Leo ,   Modi'in   (11.19.18)
Something similar happened to me, also on an El Al flight from Marseille, France to Tel Aviv, on a Friday morning, a few years ago, We were supposed to arrive three hours before Shabbath but somehow the flight was delayed in Marseille and we arrived less than one hour before Shabbat. I arrived on time just before Shabbat -- just because I happen to live in Modi'in and not Jerusalem or Haifa.

That's why I decided not to fly on Friday. I just do not trust the airlines; the information given is just not precise and timely enough to make a correct decision.

It is true that one should keep calm even in distressing circumstances, even why the airlines do not inform correctly the passengers. But the article is right: why make the religious people on a public trial ? Clearly violence is off-limits. But it seems that for some people, and especially the airlines com people, the opportunity was too great to miss to paint all Shabbat-observant people as fanatic and violent.
3. Very simple solution - don't fly near Shabbat ! Take time
barbara ,   Haifa   (11.19.18)
into the equation. It is you, the citizen, that has the responsibility to take
all possible consequences into account - not the airline. The airline has the responsibility of getting you to and from a destination - that is all.
4. Flighhts and the Shabbat
Jake Perlmutter ,   Kiryat Ata   (11.19.18)
Knowing or presuming that flights can be delayed, those religious passengers can arrange to take flights that are scheduled for landings far from Shabbat...like boarding on Sunday and then they have an allowance of 6 days in he event of delays. What they don't have is the right or privilege of imposing their will, whatever the motivation, on others. Please save me from their self-righteousness!
5. prediction from 1983
shachalnur ,   mexico   (11.19.18)
Mahmood,Dr in Biology at tel aviv university,said to me in 1983:
"Zionists don't understand the Middle East.
We're not gonna drive them into the sea.
we're gonna drive them crazy.
Then they'll start fighting eachother and then they'll leave"


6. MD retired
E. Josef Rothschild ,   Brussels   (11.19.18)
In our jekkish orthodox mind, one avoids travelling on erev shabbat!
7. Haredim
SAm   (11.19.18)
Because the orthodox and the Haredim, with some exceptions, are obnoxious bastards. It would be one thing if they observed Jewish ethics, even toward their fellow Jews, but these cheap SOBs despise anybody who is not like them. A cholera upon their heads. We, secular Jews, are pretty disgusted with them in NYC as well.
8. I believe in god also
aiman ,   Jersey   (11.19.18)
but correct me if im wrong God the creator of everything including the rules you live by would understand that things are out of your control happen like plane delays and accidents etc. that may delay you or force you to break the Sabbath. I respect your belief in god I actually admire it but God knows what's in the persons heart and if your not intentionally trying to transgress I think you'll be ok.
9. Call YOUR Shabbat any day of the week.
Michael ,   California, USA   (11.19.18)
Nobody knows when the BRESHIT started and what was the "seventh day" of creation (was there a creation?) Every one of us can pick any day she/he wants to be the Shabbat. My Shabbat is on Wednesday, my free will decision, and no one can dispute it. Those Haredim on the plane rioted because they are power hungry. Arrest them and show them the power lies with the legal system in Israel, not with punk idiots.
10. SANE LOGICAL PEOPLE WILL NEVER GET IT !
SAFED KABBALIST ,   SAFED HONESTY   (11.19.18)
11. THERE'S RELIGION .......
STIGMUND FREUD ,   SAFED GENIUS   (11.19.18)
And there's insanity. By the way, EL AL is an airline tasked with safely transporting folk from one place to another place ,and it does this extremely well and efficiently ,day after day time after time. With all due respect to Liron Nagler-cohen, we all have personal responsibility and religious jews must take personal responsibility if they are concerned with travelling close to the Sabbath or reschedule their travel plans or refrain from travel . Blaming EL AL for their lack of personal responsibility is facile and unfair. But EL AL has broad shoulders and has tolerated this for decades. By the way, even secular jews do not wish to violate shabbat by travel and I have no doubt that EL AL does its very best to preserve the sanctity of the Sabbath so some folk should cut it a little slack .
12. THE FEAR IS " TRAUMATIC "
TEL EM STRAIGHT ,   SAFED HONESTY   (11.19.18)
So DO NOT TRAVEL ,STAY HOME !
13. LEARN FROM THE TORAH :
SAFED KABBALIST ,   SAFED HONESTY   (11.19.18)
G-d ,in his infinite wisdom ,has given us all personal resposibility ,with the emphasis on PERSONAL ! El Al Airlines is not your nurse maid nor your mother ,it is an airline charged with the task of transporting you from point A to point B safely, and it does this task very well. If you are concerned about the proximity of Shabbat ,the jewish sabbath, then take personal responsibility and schedule accordingly, stop blaming others !
14. Religious or not
dorian fund ,   Tel Aviv   (11.19.18)
Lets begin by saying that violence and threats are never acceptable.
If you wish to observe the shabbat perhaps you should not push things so close. Why not travel a day earlier so that you can be safe.

If the Rabbi's can give Donald Trumps daughter, permission to travel on Shabbat, I would think that an unavoidable problem will be overlooked also.

Would it have been any different if the plane had developed mechanic failure or there was a problem at Ben Gurion and the plane had to circle for hours..

I find violence, threats and poor behavior in the name of religion anti religion and G-d will punish those who do not have religion in their hearts only their mouths.

What did we do during the Yom Kippur wars and all the other wars that took place over a sabbath..

Everyone knows there is dispensation for these conditions..

Get over yourselves.

They should prosecute and ban anyone who attempted or threatened violence.. One Jew against another.. How dare they
15. Insistance to impose one's religious norms on everyone
Shimon ,   Haifa   (11.19.18)
That is just the point, the religious impose their lifestyle on us secular people's life and schedule. They are free to live their life, and I should be free to do mine as I wish.

If you are so afraid of missing the Shabbat, stay an extra day and take another flight, or book a hotel in advance at Ben Gurion Airport.

This is your choice and should not affect the rest of us.
16. If you fly El Al
(11.19.18)
then you must count with delays. El Al is almost always delayed.
17. Gush Dan Secularists half the population half the problem
IdealismLostOnThem ,   Jerusalem Israel   (11.19.18)
half the Israeli population lives along the Secular Coastal Ghetto removed
from most things Jewish they have evolved into a sort of Westernized Israeli gentile and the only hope for Israeli Jews is a demographic revolution
by the National Traditional and Haredi Religious Public birth rate birth rate birth rate the only important thing in this country is demographics until then
we will have to suffer the indifferent secular westernized Israeli until one
day they are a tiny minority
18. I'm a militant secular BUT: this has nothing to do with
(11.19.18)
religion and EVERYTHING to do with lies& manipulation.
I love to "stick it" to the Followers of Imaginary Friend but not in this case.
El Al acts just as dumb as our govt does (sometimes): short time gains vs long time loses!
19. What you "Sane and Normal" don't get.
Ben ,   Harrisburg   (11.20.18)
I am not excusing the behavior, however, the flight was supposed to have a significant margin (5+ Hours). When that became jeopardized, the observant travelers asked and tried to re-book, for Sunday, but El Al in their wisdom (and greedy desire to keep a full flight) lied about the situation and promised something they could not keep. I do not for a second agree with the behavior of the travelers, and the reality is that breaking Shabbat through someone else' lies is not a huge avera, but I would be very angry too if the airline kept me from getting off and lied to me. El Al screwed up, the Haredi passengers embarrassed themselves. A sad story all the way around. There is a reason why many people choose other airlines.
20. OBSERVE SHABBAT !
SAFED KABBALIST ,   SAFED HONESTY   (11.20.18)
Each and every jew must do his or her best to observe the sabbath day and to keep it holy. But, it is also your responsibility to plan for delays and unexpected travel problems as far as you are able to ,take these potential hazards into consideration and plan accordingly .This is not the airline's responsibility. An airline simply wishes to function the best it can .
21. IT AINT ROCKET SCIENCE !
ALBERTO EINSTEIN ,   SAFED GENIUS   (11.20.18)
Do not wish to violate the sanctity of Shabbat ? so travel midweek and avoid the hassle .
22. Here's what the religious don't get
Vered, Israel   (11.20.18)
Religion only amplifies what you are, it doesn't help anything. If you are a status-driven a-hole, you'll compete for chessed and scholarship and bask in your reputation. If you're an entitled a-hole, you'll want the world to stop orbiting an enlist others to help in your virtue signaling. Turn off my light, I can't! Fly me here! If you're prone toward violence and racism, you'll rest easy knowing God, in his infinite wisdom, is on your team. If you're a spiritual person, religion will be your vehicle to reach the ineffable. If you're nice (as most people are) religion can bring out the best in you. The problem is, the Hareidim are told they are right and special. They live together where too much of their reasoning capacity is given to rebbe/halacha worship. When they are confronted with normal everyday frustrations, they view it religiously and freak out.
23. MERCY
dave ,   tiberius   (11.20.18)
IF YOU LOOK AT THE TORAH, PEOPLE WHO WERE TRAVELLING, WERE FORGIVEN IF THEY COULD NOT KEEP THE PASSOVER. ALSO, THERE WAS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MURDER, AND ACCIDENTALLY KILLING SOME. IN THE SAME RESPECT, I AM SURE GOD UNDERSTANDS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BREAKING THE SHABBAT DELIBERATELY, OR FOR REASONS BEYOND YOUR CONTROL..
24. DON'T FLY ON A FRIDAY!!!!!!!
Shayna Gezunt ,   London Stamford Hill   (11.20.18)
As someone who is Shomer Shabbat I never never fly on a Friday because you have to factor in for delays or any unforseen circumstances.If you keep and love Shabbat DONT FLY ON A FRIDAY!!!!
25. Wrong blame
Bill Ginnosar ,   Ginnosar   (11.22.18)
Just as I fly to Israel on Shabbat,those that really want to avoid desecrating Shabbat can fly on Yom Rishon.(building fences around the law)
ELAL is not responsible for the weather.G_d is. Blame him.
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