Opinion
The missionary danger
Ya'acov Margi
Published: 27.09.07, 18:16
Comment Comment
Print comment Print comment
Back to article
177 Talkbacks for this article
31. Drivelry of Drivelry all is Drivelry
Ariel ,   London   (09.27.07)
For your information, The New Testament says that "All Israel Will be Saved!" but not by any missionary activity! but by Mashiach. Now of course we can disagree as to who that is, but we do agree that he is coming. The irony is that you are criticizing the wrong people when you should be criticizing the Catholic Church and people like the Church of England who recently voted on a divestment policy on Israel, or would not support Israel in a crisis. Finally why on earth Oh Ya'acov Margi are you even sitting in a government that is contemplating dividing Jerusalem? What then next? "Next year in TelAviv ? Talk about straining at a gnat and swallowing a planet!
32. To JB - #18 - Just Say No
Bubba in Oklahoma ,   Oklahoma, USA   (09.27.07)
Hum ... I detect some scorn and hatred in your words. As bad a disposition you display in print, I am suprised that the Missionaries you encounter keep pestering you. These Missionaries should easily see that you have been appointed to speak for all of Israel, both past and present. How did you get through the Holy Days and not acknowelege and repent of that nasty, self-righteous attitude of yours? May I suggest that you knock on the Rebbe's door for a refresher. Hey! You can flip-off a Christian Missionary on the way!
33. #16 HARTLY
EGW ,   vancouver canada   (09.28.07)
HARTLY- I cna't even get through most of your diatribe for which I hiope you'll forgive me. I stopped reading whn I , and would indicate that much of the whole content is likewise dubious. NO PERSON IN ISRAEL IS STARVING.....period.
34. #19 ELLEN
(09.28.07)
GOOD FOR YOU. You said everything I was trying to, in just a few incisive words. Chag Sameach
35. Missionaries Danger?
WJ MC CALMAN ,   USA   (09.28.07)
I don't think Ya'acov Margi understands the Christians heart. If there are missionaries who are acting as he says, they don't represent the true Christians. Our hearts are filled with love for the Chosen People of Israel and not for any ulterior motive. It has been put into us by the father of Abraham, Issac and Jacob. Is it really so hard to believe that we would desire heavenly protection of Apples of God's eye? We pray daily and some of pray for Israel more than we do ourself. The USA is in great danger because of our love for Israel and her people and to accuse us of ulterior motives is paranoid. I would like to remind you that it was these same Christian people who freed the horrible death camps for the remaining prisoners of Hitler. How can you spread more lies in times like these. A lot of us have given up the luxury of things we would like to have in order to support you and stand beside you in this hour. This is type of talk that has caused so much hate in the past. Please start looking at things correctly and sensibly. Shalom
36. Re: 1. An American's point of view
Observer ,   Austin   (09.28.07)
Congratulations on such a bigoted assessment. I'm not sure how to begin to list what's wrong with those comparisons of yours, but I'll give it a try. 1) Perhaps you didn't bother to read the article or, well, learn anything about Judaism, so since you missed it, let me repeat it for you: Jews don't seek converts. Jews don't missionize. Christians come to Israel for the purpose of missionizing. Jews living in those countries did not. No missionizing, ergo no threat of Jewish conversion. Duh. 2) I'm not going to get into the antisemitic character of your comparison of a 1 year jail term to pogroms, the holocaust, the inquisition, etc. I'd suggest "you do the math," but I think your bigotry clouds your judgment.
37. I would rather a christian party over Shas
Moshe ,   Jerusalem   (09.28.07)
How dare you pretend to care about the Jewish people! Your party sold Israel down the pipe by voting in favor of Oslo for a couple of sheckels. You voted for Shimon Peres as president even though his oppisition to Judiasm is well known for a couple of sheckles. Your whole party would convert to Christianity for a couple of Sheckels. Who wrote this article for you? I happen to know you do not speak a word of English.
38. to Mr. Margi--Ynet please print-very important
Brooke   (09.28.07)
I believe your grave, immediate concerns are misplaced. Rather than focusing on the Evangelicals, you should use your immense energy and influence to take your party out of this gov't.. If the Evangelicals can cause some Jews harm, just imagine what your PM, president and gov't will do if you continue to divide all of Hashem's land, divinely sanctioned only to the Jews. I do not see any articles or marches from your party regarding the rape on the Temple Mount, sanctioned by your gov't. Do the honourable thing and bring this gov't down. Perhaps then, your credibility will be restored and your words will ring with honesty and trust. Save Eretz Yisrael..NOW!!
39. Reply to Bubba #32
JB   (09.28.07)
Unfortunately, I am not appointed to speak for anyone but myself. If I were, I would make christian missionary work an offense in Israel -- not punishable by imprisonment, but by fines. That would minimize the burden of the missionaries on the JEWISH state. I am not interested in flipping anyone off. I am merely sick and tired of the false hand of friendship extended by christian missionaries. There is no hatred in my words -- merely irritation that christians must pester others with mawkish and yes -- self-righteous -- prattle about god and love, yet turn their backs on fellow christians who need real help in this world now in their own backyards. As to the "Rebbe" whoever that may be, you've got the wrong Jew Bubba. Missionaries offend non-haredi Jews as much as they offend Haredi Jews. Tell you what: When the muslims come to Oklahoma and start telling you about how wrong you are, and how they are right, and don't you want to talk about the bible, and can't you see you are reading it wrong and don't you know the koran and mohammed says this and that and sura 43 or 53 or whatever proves that they are right -- you turn the other cheek, smile and walk away after wishing them a fine day. Then the next time, and the time after that, and the time after that. . . You'll get irritated too. You might even flip them off. You might even eventually want a law passed to make them leave you alone. Oops, the First Amendment will stop that -- so maybe you'll want the constitution amended so they'll leave you alone.
40. To BART Cunningham
EGW ,   vancouver canada   (09.28.07)
Bart,- No it's not the same. In the first place, Jews are NOT trying to convert Christians or Moslems etc. Secondly, that Christians ARE devoting hundreds of millions of dollars every year to their cherished goal of Jew-conversion, IS a big danger when you consider who they're focussing on. They are driven by their foolish belief that if the Jews convert then Jesus will return. Why does Jesus need to return? Because none of the supposed results of a Messiah happened when he was "repudedly" around. Even his very existence is mainly a fictitious concoction. When you realise that the Greeks and Egyptians believed in fictitious gods for at least double the time that Christianity has existed, welllll.....AND FINALLY Bart, NO people in the world has EVER been treated the way that the innocent, harmless Jews have been massacred and destroyed by Christians. All because they wouldn't convert, because they just were there- living- showing the LIE to the major Christian belief that Christianity was the successor to Judaism and that Judaism was "sterile", "doomed", would disappear (HAD TO disappear) and was not relevant. That Israel was reconstituted was an enormous shock to the Christian world, and they're still coming to grips with it. Their latest trickery is "catching the fly with "honey". Well, thank heaven, all Jews don't have a sweet tooth. And those very few who do succumb, are mainly not really Jews or have severe psychological problems. I've met some of these lunatics myself, which is a whole story in itself. Mit Mazal !!
41. Missionaries
M. Hartley ,   Atlanta, US   (09.28.07)
After years of being pestered at the crack of dawn on Saturday mornings by Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses, I came up with a solution that exceeded my wildest expectations and got rid of both. Being a nice Southern girl, I charmingly insisted that they make appointments, if they wanted to have a conversation with me. They gladly jumped on that one. So, I made appointments for both of them for the same day and time. Once they were enthroned in the living room, I had run out of pleasantries and got nothing but dead silence in return, I excused myself to go for some refreshments and suggested that they talk to each other in my absence. Actually, I was afraid to burst out laughing at the way these good Christians glared at each other. It wasn't even half a minute after I had gone to the kitchen that I heard the front door slam. Having heard only one loud bang and wondering with whom I'd be stuck, I peeked around the corner only to find the couch and chairs deserted by everybody. I have never seen two bicycles tear up my drive or watched two women hoofing it towards their car so fast in my entire life. I don't know where on the house or on which tree they put the red X or the skull and bones, but since that day I haven't seen hide or hair of either. A Christian-Muslim session like that would just have to be worth its time in hilarity. Sometimes, you simply have to beat pests at their own game with their own methods. If you have fun in the process, so much the better.
42. To # 33
M. Hartley ,   Atlanta, US   (09.28.07)
I guess you didn't read or understand the article, either. Here's a copy of a part of it: Why would you hand food to people who aren't hungry? Oh, and you may want to read this article of 8-23-07 in this very publication: Ignoring me would have been better than playing dumb. Then again, maybe you weren't playing.
43. All it takes is a Book Bag?
guy ,   los angeles   (09.28.07)
Of all the dangers Israel faces, this is the smallest--we have honest-to-goodness Christian friends who want to help us and all we can say is that this is subversive-this makes it sound like Christians are child molesters waiting for school recess!
44. This really saddens me..
Nancy ,   Whittier, USA   (09.28.07)
I am a Christian & I have given to many Jewish charities & causes only because I have a genuine deep love for the Jewish people & nation. I frequently pray for the peace of Israel & defend their right to exist. They are & always will be the apple of God's eyes.
45. Any facts?
Bryan ,   Minneapolis - USA   (09.28.07)
As a religious Jew in America who is friends with many religious Christians, it's maddening our own paranoia. Respectfully, what's the data? Relative to what? Can Christians genuinely want to help without us assigning biggoted motives? The MK should read Michael Oren's Power, Faith, or Fantasy, as well as Pastor Hagee's Jerusalem Countdown to get a little more information before leveling these uneducated comments.
46. Kol Hakavod, Yakov Margi !
Dave ,   Toronto, Canada   (09.28.07)
Kol Hakavod, Yakov Margi ! However, I disagree with you to some extent. We Jews should promote Pure Monotheism. Pure Monotheism is a belief we have in common with Muslims, Unitarians, and Sikhs. Furthemore it is the key essential belief of our Faith. This is what the missionary wing of Christianity wants us to give up. This is a belief that our forefathers and foremothers died rather than give up. And they were right, since if I as a Jew were ever to give up my belief in Hashem's Unity and Incorporeality and Unknowableness and Omnipotence, then my Judaism is over. As long as I still believe that God is a Unity- unlike any other unity, and is Incorporeal and Omnipotent and Unknowable, then I can hold on to my Judaism.
47. Kiruv Yes, Jail No
Shmuel Addams ,   Jerusalem, Israel   (09.28.07)
If concerned about Jews converting out of Judaism, then reinforce Jewish identity through Kiruv. The Chabbad model has worked for almost half a century. Aish Hatora has been succeeding since the 70's in a similar vein. Breslav has more recently jumped on the bandwagon too. Carlbach and others have also had good results. Kiruv works. Hostility does not (well, ok, it does sometimes, but you attract the wrong people). The use of force in coping with Christian missionaries is not the answer. Mr. Margi is clearly a small-minded politician who's demagogic rant against Christianity represents his attempt to build his popularity amongst a marginal, ignorant and reactive sector of the population.
48. Rivkah, Thank You!
Madeline ,   USA   (09.28.07)
You have spoken beautifully and truly. What you say is the core of the issue, in my opinion, but it gets overlooked, all too often. Jews are the root, Christians are the branch. Jews MUST protect their integrity, I would add...Must respect themselves. If a Jew knows Jesus, do it in such a way that the body of Jews is not threatened. God is One. Jesus is a Jew; he is not a gentile, nor even a 'Messianic believer.' One can see through 2000years of gentile distortions and hate to get at pure truth. This may seem like nonsense to some, but to the wise, it will make perfect sense.
49. The Reason for Aliyah
Yakov ,   USA   (09.28.07)
The whole reason for making Aliyah is to increase one's sense of Jewishness. It's about coming home. It doesn't make snse that those who go there would all of a sudden feel a "weak" sense of being Jewish when they're surrounded by it day-by-day. Besides, there are much more pressing problems to the Olim than missionaires. Tell them NO. Then, move on to the more pressing issues of integrating and finding one's role in the advancement of the Jewish Nation and people.
50. MK Margi
Ian Myerscough ,   Reading UK   (09.28.07)
Dear Sir, Though I sympathize with the Jewish memory of Papal outrages of the middle ages, the same outrages were perpetrated against the poor evangelical believers of Italy 's Lollards, France's Waldensians and every other european group of simple non Catholic saints. To somehow pretend that the present day evangelical Christians are the descendants of their erstwhile torturers is a historical nonsense. May I suggest 'The Torch of the Testimony' by Kennedy, or books by Prof G Guinness to help your context building. A friend of Israel (And Israel needs friends!)
51. #9, Rivkah
Vicki ,   USA   (09.28.07)
Jesus never said that we are to become Jews in our hearts. He said we are to love G-d with all our hearts, soul, mind and strength, and to love our neighbors as ourselves.
52. #49 - Reason for Aliyah?
David ,   Jerusalem   (09.28.07)
I think you have a narrow perspective. You are speaking from the perspective of an anglo (or western european) who generally makes aliyah for ideological reasons. We are, however, the exception to the rule in terms of aliyah (with the exception of the very first waves). The waves of aliyah since the founding of the state were largely motivated by a completely different set of factors from being stateless refugees, to escaping persecution, to improving one's economic lot. In short, by necessity rather than ideology.
53. a true Christian must evangelise
bruno ,   france   (09.28.07)
inspite of Mr.Margis views which are very confused. Jews must be told that Jesus is the Messiah they wait for so long time now. i think these are very good news. i am glad to see that parlamentary religious people get nervous on this. this is a good sign.
54. #1
Joe Jew ,   Jerusalem   (09.28.07)
The comparision is imbecilic, We are not persecuting anyone, nor killing them. we are simply reminding them that we are proud of our own heritage and do not look kindly on their misleading others. When missionaries cease using fraudulent methods, we will leave them in peace.
55. Terry and old fasioned ranting
jewboy ,   jerusalem   (09.28.07)
your words are quotes from the eighteenth century, and so is their tone. Grow up and look at the world as it is. Hareidim will be israel's majority as soon as today's school pupils graduate.
56. Hartly and having a heart
Just a jew ,   jerusalem   (09.28.07)
Shas actually do work with the underpriveleged. they do work with the disadvantaged. that is the whole point. When help and assistance is made conditional on abandoning faith and fraudulent methods used, then those who truly want to help get angry. hence shas is angry at missionary frauds.
57. #56, about Jewish racism and protectionism
Bart Cunningham ,   Amsterdam Holland   (09.28.07)
I'm sorry #56, but to me these two processes are not that different at all. Israel is clearly protective of its culture, ethnicity and heritage and goes to great lengths to keep outsiders out (as permanent residents at least) and the Jews inside as pure as possible. I don’t necessarily oppose that, but is this protectionist policy and mindset not basically the same thing anti-Semites and other racial groups have applied to Jewish minorities in their midst? And should Israel, as a nation which resulted from racism, really emulate that kind of bigotry? IMO, no. In the end, one either condones racism and practices it, or condemns it and refrains from it. There should be no cherry picking in such matters.
58. I studied in a missionary School....Well
ben ,   singapore   (09.28.07)
I never saw a day passed by without the Word ' Jews this Jews that " to date I can remember. On Yom Kippur, I was telling the Lrd all the ill treatment and I never felt comfortable with them. I will never ever trust them, sometime I just choos to remain silent, but I am a stubborn boy from those days. I remember their Saint Hurbert, the jew boy who was converted an became the Bishop of Leigh.I found some inspiration in their saint hurbert, the stubborn jew boy of old germany. But I am still stubborn I said within the Torah and Talmud. That name Hurbert only made me stronger. When I go, I go to Hashem and to Hashem I will return. As for you children of Yisarel, remain steadfast to Adoxxxx to the end of you last breath, recite the Shema everytime they come near. REMEMBER , REMEMBER, REMEMBER! WE HAVE THE BOOK TELL THEM TO CROSS OVER THIS SIDE FOR WE HAVE THE TRUTH AND THE TORAH IS WITH US. WE SHALL KEEP IT AND TEACH THEM AGAIN AND AGAIN ! ben singapore
59. 24 - israeli children's schoolbooks don't use the + sign
mike ,   israel (formerly usa   (09.28.07)
the + sign is on keyboards (which is why i can type it), but unfortunately paranoid hysteria rules when it comes to schoolbooks here.
60. Jewish people need to realise
Kev ,   London   (09.28.07)
...that the only reason that they have such great support from America, is because Christianity has enabled those gentile peoples to live and work in peace. They do this alongside Jewish people, and do not persecute them whilst those Jewish peoples do well in business and industry. Most gentile nations do not have this attitude towards the Jews. America is very Christian orientated. Jewish friends - imagine if America were as hostile to you as Iran, Syria or Russia. That is what you would face were Christ not glorified within that nation and were He not governing it to your blessing. Christ is blessing Israel through the gentile peoples of America, and Israel does not even seem to know it some of the time.
Previous talkbacks
Next talkbacks
Back to article