Opinion  Others
Patrilineal descent
Yossi Beilin
Published: 31.10.05, 12:01
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61. if all accept patrilineal descent rabbis would recognize it
mike ,   usa   (11.01.05)
isn't that the essence of 'tradition'?
62. @Ruth's conversion/RuthBracha
Gena Raivich ,   London UK   (11.02.05)
It is a common error to assume that Ruth converted during the crossing into the Land of Israel. In fact, both Ruth and Orpa converted before they married Machlon and Kilyon. The utterings Ruth made at the crossing were just a reflection of her sincerity. Because of this, Boaz could acquire Ruth in Levirate marriage, and his uncle [Ploni Almoni] who had a stronger claim, had to submit to the Chalitza ceremony. If Ruth converted after her Jewish husband has died, that marriage wouldn't have been valid, and hence would have been no need for the Chalitza ceremony for Boaz's uncle... Maybe even Goliath, who descended from Orpa, was also Jewish. If he was, and behaving as he did, he seems to have met the just fate.
63. Yossi Beilin
seymour ,   Berkeley, USA   (11.02.05)
One thing you can say about Beilin--he's consistent. He expresses the view of secular Israelis who see their attachment to the Israeli state only in nationalistic terms. Thus Beilin in his "Geneva accords" could so easily surrender the religious sites to the Palestinians since they have no historic or religious significance to him. Similarly, with the Jewish tradition of defining Jewishness matrilineally--it has no meaning for him. Fortunately, most Israelis do not share his "enlightened" views suggesting that Meretz-Yahad will remain peripheral and of little consequence in Israeli history.
64. I don't believe Beilin's story...
G ,   Montreal, Canada   (11.02.05)
Beilin's story of the Danish Jewess who was not Halachically Jewish rings false to me. How is it possible for a person steeped in knowledge of Judaism (as he implies) not to realize that their non-Jewish status (according to Halacha) would be a problem if they wanted to marry a (Halachic) Jew in an Orthodox Synagogue?! Even a person with a basic knowledge of Judaism knows that "you're Jewish if your mom is Jewish". The story is poignant, but a figment of Beilin's overcooked imagination. By falsifying or embellishing this incident, he casts a cloud over the rest of the article.
65. Patrilineal descent
Steve Katz ,   Forest Hills, NY USA   (11.02.05)
What a flawed idea. Virtually all the Catholic religions hold the children to be of the religion of the mother, as does Judaism. To me, this just smacks of another attempt by the non-religious left to destroy Judaism. Instead of changing the rules, why not try observing them (for once).
66. Will Rabbis realise that we are in the 21st century ?
Hiram ,   Tel Aviv   (11.02.05)
Micha....good and pacifying explanation...Indeed Mater Certa , Pater non certus est ...hence the Matrilienal descent....but indeed why shutting off all the " non kosher" Jews who simply want to come here because they do understand the importance of their origins and their heritage..Are Rabbis so afraid of compassion ?
67. To Ariel from Canberra
Hiram ,   Tel Aviv   (11.02.05)
Ouaaaaaaa ! Other countries which are spiritually poor ! because of course where you live , Ariel, the country is certainly spiritually rich !. Who the hell are you to judge if a country is spiritually poor or spiritually rich ! As for Israel my friend, I will believe in the spirituality when Doxim roaming in the Jewish Quarter and around the Kotel will give blessing ....for free... Don't make me laugh with your spiritual richness ! I know plenty of religious who derive from Bnei Brak to Tel Barouch at night ...!!!! for spiritual enrichment !!! Shame on you....
68. To David 58
Hiram ,   Tel Aviv   (11.02.05)
David, the answer is no . The watchdogs of "ethnicity" do not considere you as elligible for the law of return. You would have to undergo an Orthodox conversion. I know it
69. YOU'RE ALL WRONG
DACON9   (11.02.05)
EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU COMMENTATORS ARE SO WRONG. YOU ALL NEED AN EDUCATION AND A WHIPPING. IT IS A WELL KNOWN FACT THAT MOST AMERICAN JEWS LOVE CHINESE FOOD ON SUNDAY NIGHTS=. AND THE TREND DUE TO SO MANY KOSHER RESTURANTS OPENING ARE NOW EATING CHINESE FOOD EVEN ON WEEK DAYS. AND MOST JEWS REALLY DO OPEN THOSE FORTUNE COOKIES ,SOME ARE USING CHOP STICKS TO EAT WITH. THIS IS POSITIVE PROVE BEYOND ANY BRILLIANT DEFENCE ATTORNEY OR ANY GREAT TORAH SAGE THAT MOST JEWS IF NOT ALL JEWS ARE DEFINITELY CHINESE.
70. I'm all right
Lior ,   London   (11.02.05)
I will point out that the majority of the world's Jews do not in fact live in America - with or without a penchant for Chinese food, kosher or not, on Erev Shabbat. The Jewish population of America is in steep demographic decline. And this is not necessarily because of patrilineal descent. By 2015, the majority of the world's Jews will live in Israel. It is thus there that the decisions as to what constitutes a Jew will have remifications around the world - however right-on American Reform Jews are. Now, this is a serious discussion, Dacon9, which involves a lot of heartache and soul-searching. We can do without your banalities, thank you.
71. Are you there G-d, It's me Margaret
Rachel ,   Israel   (11.02.05)
Extract from a book by Judy Blume "Grandmother smiled at last and gave a small laugh. 'So Margaret is Christian!' she announced, like we all should have known. 'Please....' my mother said. 'Margaret could just as easily be Jewish!' " This is a tragic and difficult situation and really Margaret's father should have thought of that before he married out. You can blamed the rabbis in this country for a lot but this is a principle that has been with us for a couple of thousand years. Plus we needed how to define it - poor Margaret doesnt know who she is. However all these chaps who like to wax lyrical on the evils of Jewish women , turn round after years with the lovely Christina and expect their children to be Jewish and then attack the rabbis. All this after years of whining about Jewish women in the most racist terms possible. You cant have your cake and eat it!
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