Israel will need to end this war, but it must end it properly this time. Lebanon must be controlled completely by the Lebanese government. Only then can permanent peace with the Lebanese prevail. The Lebanese could not deal with Hizbollah as they are heavily armed, ideology driven and well funded by the 4th largest oil producer. Israel went in at the right time - in 2000 the world had not experinced terror - today the western world is at war with terror. In 2000 Orna was right to cry for IDF to get out of Lebanon. There was no winning exit strategy for Israel. Today you are wrong Orna. This one has a clear win win exit for Israel and Lebanon. Unfortunately civilians are suffering on both sides, but hopefully this can be won quickly provided we fight aggressive.

Manfred, you goof, more likely than not, N Carroll is a straight male feminist. The worst kind. Hey, NC, do you read any history? How about 20th century British history? What do you think Thatcher would be doing about now if she were PM? Yup, she'd be doing a lot more killing than Merlot. This is in her favor, of course. And, even though Golda Meir was NOT beyond reproach, she would be doing pretty much what Thatcher would be doing, I'd guess.

We are the Palestinians, the only democracy aside with the Lebanese one, and see what you civilized democratic world doing to both of our people. We are trying to be different than the other dectatorship regemes US supporting. Now do we deserve to be in Palestine or not, aska native indian in Colorado, and he will answer you. And for the thousand time, two wrongs does not make it right.

You are missing the point of the article and you seem to be comapring israel to the hizbollah. Lets look at this, Israel pulled out of Lebanon, completely.. Recognized by everyone to have done so. Now Israel has been attacked and for what reason exactly?? It cant possibly because of Israel occupying Lebanon? Or because Israel attacked Lebanon? You see, there is no comparison. One side attacked and continues to do so. The Israeli response is correct in that thay are killing terrorists, who want to bring down Israel and Lebanon also. Perhaps a visit to the region would benefit you before you resond.

first to 36 first of all we are not weaker than you and don't count the wepons cause the well and belive in God is more important than weapons , we all belive in that and days will pass and you will see what i mean. we didn't lost our wars becouse of soldiers or poeple or weapons, we lose it unfortunatly becouse we have a group of leaders chosen by USA and approved from Isreal to change the way of muslim thinks of Jehad and defend our own relegion and lands and by using the economic and live issues to send our thinking to not important things in life like work and eating . we don't belame u on that but be sure that next generation will work on this issue and the winning of Hamas is the begining of this direction. for example i am learning my childrens on that from now . since we have a case we will demand evry thing we have from now until next 1300 y. ok. to 46 it is true that in 2000 there was meetings , but it was not completed and it was under presure , we have many rights was missing in that deal and Arafat did the right thing at that time . What isreal want is to put is in isolated areas and to control evrything in our lives . this is not accepteble since i told u that we have the right and we will work on it untill we have it , by peace or like what we have both now , u will win one or two times but belive me at the end we will do it and we are not in hurry. thanks

Manfred and sk, you have made my point absolutely. Faced with a different thinking you have responded with cheap jibes, does that show intelligence? They are quite unjustified as it happens and gave my wife considerable amusement. She hopes your egos don't trip you up. Manfred, I do read history and have probably forgotten more than you know. What history does show us is that oppression,however severe, never works in the long run and the oppressor eventually fails. We must remember however that history is written by the immediate victor and is therefore suspect. I do hope that your bile does not give you any more trouble. N C. ps: re Thatcher and Meir, I was of course talking about normal women.

Before Barak's withdrawal from Lebanon, helped by you and correctly regarded as a victory for Hezbollah, there was peace in northern Israel. You are like the American Communists who remained true believers after Stalin's horrors were revealed.

You havent answered my reply as I have not used cheap jibes at you and would care to know what exactly you would do with Hizbollah, as you seem to think they can be talked to. As for your obession with the occupation, perhaps you should know that Israel withdrew from Lebanon, so there is no occupation there. So what exactly are they fighting for? As for the Palestinians, it is time they and you realised that Israel is here to stay and to talk accordingly. Not say, we want this and that. and not actually giving anything back. I dont want to here the usual left wing nonsense of, well Israel took this.. Every country in war takes land.. it takes two to talk.. So its time the PA decided to talk and stop the terrorism.

Grand Mufti: In 1940, al-Husseini requested the Axis powers to acknowledge the Arab right: ... to settle the question of Jewish elements in Palestine and other Arab countries in accordance with the national and racial interests of the Arabs and along the lines similar to those used to solve the Jewish question in Germany and Italy.

Why don't you Irish give back Northern Ireland. You can have true peace, you mutton head.

I did not reply immediately to your letter as it was a sensible one and worthy of a considered reply. Israel is receiving condemnation from all over the world for using disproportionate force in Gaza and now Lebanon. However, although there is also Jewish disquiet at Israels actions(and if you live in London you will know that, even from the JC ), on the whole, Jews round the world and especially in America are supporting Israel (even if through gritted teeth ) and this is natural from the blood thicker than water syndrome. Is it therefore surprising that Arabs in Lebanon should wish to show solidarity with ordinary,civilian Arabs being murdered in Gaza ? It is exactly the same response in essence. Read the hate-filled letters, many from America, that fill these columns, whose writers are clamouring to "kill the Arabs, kill all of them". Where is the difference ? I am certainly not anti-Jew, I am not even anti- Israel but I am anti the current Israeli behaviour. I am horrified by terrorist behaviour, on both sides and I do not condone the harming of anyone. Israel must realise that the world knows of its long term plans to retain more and more occupied land and that this is the last straw for the Arabs. Nonetheless you have the right to defend yourselves from attacks. What you do not have is the right to kill many, many civilians,women and children. The pictures tonight from Lebanon are terrible. I agree that it has become almost impossible now to see a way out apart from a return to 67, but what is obvious is that the present Israeli action is the very worst it could take. You are breeding future Israel haters with every bomb you drop. I hope this goes some way to explaining my feelings, which basically are ones of horror, and I hope you can accept that my feelings are just as valid as yours. Let us not give up hope. N C.

Yes you are, and should be hanged in accordance with the laws of war times, which are absent in Israel.

If you wish an honest discussion, please tell us why when Sinai, Gaza Strips , the Judea, the Samaria, East Jerusalem were occupied by Arab imperialists usurpers Israel needed to fight in five wars and loose 24 000 lives? How many signatures away was the peace you profess when (May 14 of 1967) the passionate mass murderer Hamal Abdel Nasser said: "Even if only the land of Tel-Aviv would have been in the jewish hands we would never agree with its existence"

Within 20 years of Israel presence in South Lebanon, Israel lost the lives of 1017 soldiers and 2348 were wounded. In the six years since surrending to islamo-fascist hordes Israel lost the lives of its 1609 people and got 11 000 maimed for life and wounded. Surely, Israel is not yet a "normal" country if this type of subversive psychopathic scoundrels, liers and felons as Shimoni can not be hanged by the laws of war time.

Many thanks for your reply but as ever (always the way) I disagree with you on alot of points. Firstly, Jews in the UK support Israel because we know damn well what would happen if the Arabs ever won a war. It would be a massacre of every Jew in Israel. As for your comments on Arabs in Lebanon supporting the people of Gaza because they are one religion is slightly false, as one is Shiite and one is Sunni and they have very different outlooks on things. Their only shared aim is the destruction of Israel as defined in the Hamas charter and repeatly called for by Hizbollah. There is also the Gulf countries that are against Hizbollah because they know who is pulling the strings. As for sitting and watching the TV, i find it amusing that the BBC / channel 4, never show the casualties in Israel or even mention that two kids where killed (who were arab) You say that Israel is after more land.. Bit silly to leave Lebanon and Gaza and uproot 9000 jews if they want to keep the land and Gaza was a good community with economic growth and even supplying jobs to the arabs.. And thats gone, so I dont think you can be saying Israel wants the land when they were giving it back. That will stop now since as soon as land is given back they launch rockets and attacks from it. Also, why exactly should Israel return to the '67 borders? Since that is where the arabs launched their attacks from. The borders then are undefendable and for the security of a sovereign state, cannot be returned to without commiting mass suicide. Plus, Israel won the wars, so it is up to the arabs to open talks and try and offer something constructive instead of the usual lets destroy Israel. So until the arabs can come up with some peace agreement that takes into account Israel's needs and security and also offers a true peace. I honestly think it will continue as all I see and hear from them is blatant anti-semitism and calls for the destruction of Israel (see Iran for that one) Well on a happier note, we can always hope and who knows maybe out of the mess some good people can come.

I respect your sons. They are true heroes, but I despise both of you, Cindy and Orna; you should be ashamed of yourselves! And by the way Cindy, your humor is stupid and much uncalled for; you are not funny!

The arabs are fighting because they did not agree with the BRITISH decision to GIVE you a state and relocate HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS chirstians, and muslims living there in 1948. They will continue to fight until there is a peaceful negotiation. If you cannot return to the negotiation table, eventually they will aquire a nuke, and then its really all over. So, swallow your pride, stop being cocky because of the armerican funded army that makes you feel invincible, make a clear cut deal that benefits both sides, not like the pullout over a year ago from gaza which did not benefit the palestians at all, and maybe fifty years from now we will still be alive to enjoy life.

Once we finish up with hiz-bullah,let us put these four murderers on trial for treason.They sold us out to the enemy.And the same goes for barak! What makes them think that they are military tacticians and experts on terrorism?They are four witches that should have never opened their stupid mouths.

Interesting how you blame Israel for trying to start WW3!! Since we know that is what Iran wants, as then or so he beleives the Mahdi will return and the world will be a muslim caliphate. So according to your theory, israel is responsible for the muslim bombings in India, Chechenya, Russia, Bali? East Timor? Attacking the twin towers? the bombings in Madrid and London. The attacking of synagogues in Argentine, bombings in turkey?? To me, it looks like muslims are causing the problems in the world. in fact all over the world, is Islamic terrorists who target civilians and have the blood lust. As for your comments about 1948.. The british just returned what was and always will be the Jewish homeland. If you need proof, read the bible and the Koran as g-d promised Israel to the jews.. No one else. So YOU should stop trying to blame the Jews as lets work out... 15-16 million jews in the world and over 1 billion muslims.. so who causing the trouble???

"And now, we, the women of "Four Mothers," stand accused of causing the second intifada. This evil accusation sometimes borders on incitement to murder." Cut this crap! It is high time that leftists stopped using the term "incitement" merely in order to stifle any form of legitimate criticism.

Orna Shimoni, yes it is your fault, but I suspect that like so many "leftists", you are a person who thinks that it ispossible to create truth from mere fantsy or outright verbal violence. I belive intelligence analysts attributed the outbreak of the second intififa to 2 factors: (1) the withdrawal from Lebanon, which was perceived as a sign of weakness; (2) the frustration caused by the roadblocks in the territories. Just in case you were hoping I was a rabid right-winger, I have obviously proved you wrong by quoting the second factor. Sorry!

# 78, maybe you are right, but by phrasing yourself in this manner you are doing exactly what Orna Simoni wants: to prove that her opponents are inarticulate.

What is inarticulate about my comments? Those four murderes are not military people,just four stupid leftists looking for their 15 mins. Now she is writting this to cover her ass.But we know who is to blame for the second intifada,selling out our So.Lebanese Army comrades in blood.For the deaths of soldiers and civilians on the borders.For letting the terrorists build up infrasture on our border.For the death and destruction in our cities and towns in the north. It is so clear that even a dolt like you can see. They do not even need a trial.They are guilty.The same goes for barak!

In response to #7. Your 10 steps to peace sound like the Oslo Accords. It is the Palestainians that walked away with Arafat as their representative. I do not believe that peace is what is wanted. America gives money to the Palestainians as well as the Israelis. What do they do with the money? Is certainly is not used to build a social structure or make their society healthier. They have built a society of death not peace. It is hard to make a peace treaty with someone who perpetrates war.

Israel is the centre of the new "axis of evil" supported by the USA and I'm ashamed to say the UK. Genocide and ethnic cleansing are not the answer. You are losing the support of everyone except neo-nazis. Do you really think a new holocaust is going to win you friends? Jewish people like me are automatically in favour of Israel but now it's like defending the nazis with photos of auschwitz in your hand. Please let me feel proud of my heritage!