read http://hebpolitics.blogspot.com/ where treatment is discussed with a torah perspective

... how to interpret in a different way : "a man can not lie with another man as if he was a woman" ?

The Synagogue is a full part of the Reform movement. I assume their Beit Din and responsa council met and decided to accept homosexuality. Many conservative synagogues also accept gays. Keren, the Torah was written htousands of years ago. You have to take many issues in historical context.

Perhaps the test, S Judah, is for straight people to be able to love and accept even those who are different and that you do not understand. Admit you do not know the mind of God and that God's plan is not always disernable.

See the result. Other kinds of "reforms"were tried in Judaism in order to please some "clients".They always resulted in disaster for us,starting with christianity and the supposed yeshu,"the reformist".See the result. Trying to change Torah doesn't change our promise. If "reformists" want to change the Torah,it is because they want to create another religion,which will end up in disaster for Jews,once again. Jews accepted the Torah as a whole.Those who do not accept that ,are distanting themselves from Torah and Judaism and can not call that judaism,I repeat. Judaism can not be adapted to sinners ,and to those forcefully insisting in sin,and also it can not be adapted to any other interests,as power or whatever. We don't have middle terms:or we accept the Torah,or we accept the Torah. History(G'od) has shown us the result of disobedience!It is time to learn! One doesn't need to be religious,but it is an ABOMINATION to impose SIN to Judaism. If gays wish ,they can live WITHOUT religion and face the consequences individualy ,what ,I suppose ,will affect less the whole,but they CAN NOT draw all Jews to their disgrace! We Jews are ONE soul:what we do have consequences in all our People.

The tired argument that the Torah was written thousands of years ago is the weapon of the non-believer. People were people thousands of years ago, and if HaShem gave us rules for how to behave as people, He didn't just mean it for the time of the Exodus from Egypt. We were not created, individually or as a species, to have romantic and sexual relationships with our own gender, regardless of what the flaky gay crowd would like to have us believe.

There is a world-wide Jewish Organization named JONAH that helps men and women with unwanted same-sex attraction (SSA) grow out of homosexuality. Go to our web site, www.jonahweb.org , and contact us. No one is born gay and help is available. Elaine Silodor Berk, Co-Director of JONAH

Keren, no one is disputing that a man is not allowed to lie with another man, according to the Torah. There is no other way to interpret "a man can not lie with another man as if he was a woman." What I'M saying is that the Torah does NOT say anything about BEING gay. There is no issur regarding that at all. People who say it is against Halacha or wrong to be gay are misguided and unlearned. The prohibition is against an ACT, not an orientation. So please, stop spreading hate and misinformation. And for anyone else who is advocating their hate policies and tirades against gays, how the hell is being gay a choice?? Can you choose to be gay? I think not. In the same way, someone who is gay cannot choose to be straight. The JONAH organization is a joke.

Baruch, what about the gay crowd is flaky? I love being Jewish. But, come on, you can't take everything in the Torah literally. Afterall, there are several things we do not do anymore such as stoning sinners etc.. How do you know what we are created to do? You are not Hashem? I am Gay and was born that way. Get out the stone age.

Elaine, poor darling, you are very missguided. Homosexuality is not a disease. Therefore, it is not something that has to be cured. G-d loves me for who I am. Your organization is a fraud because you are not able to do what you claim you are capable of.

You are trying to make a play with words that absolutely doesn't make any sense.It doesn't make sense neither to smarts not to dumbs.It is simply without meaning what you say.

If you had listened to the rest of that talk that you made fun of, you'd understand. You were drawn to be gay, and you didn't listen to the Torah that told you that you, and not your impulses, are in control of your life, or should be. Mitzvahs aren't necessarily things we naturally do, nor are always easy to do (or not do), but everyone is capable of fulfilling them.

The Torah says we should stone to death any child who shows disrespect for his/her parents. I wonder if you three take this verse as seriously as you do the verse regarding homosexuality? Being a "light unto the nations" is not simply a matter of checking of 613 boxes, it requires intelligence and ethics. You three and this rebbe run a deficit for our people, and make it that much more difficult for the rest of us to be such a light.

You can argue whatever you want, but the Torah, as long as we understand its essence, is true. The old standard of pointing to stoning a child as an attack on the Torah is absurd. As a matter of fact, it's probably never been done. But, parenthetically, if the parents of that kid who shot up Virginia Tech or of the Columbine students had stoned them to death when they were behaving the way they were as youngsters, perhaps many other kids would be alive today. You are just continuing to try to justify the unjustifiable, which is aberrant sexual behavior. You are not being a "light unto nations" by shtupping another man's poophole. Trust me on that.

Baruch, I am in controol of my life. Being in controol means acknoledgeing who I am, I a Gay Jewish man. By the way, I belong to a Gay Synagogue. What does being gay or straight have do do with fulling mitzvot?

"In conclusion, the rabbi wrote: "We need to know how to deal with homosexuality, which is the sin of our time, and woe to us for having come to this. We need to know how to deal with those sons of Israel born as homosexuals, in order to ease their pain, and to show them that there are other ways to find true happiness." A rabbi said the above? Virtually every mainstream psychological, medical, and Psychiatric association in America says that being gay is an inborn trait. Of course here in America we also have the "fixer" community who believe that gays can be "cured". Cured of what - whose business is it to interfer with consensual age appropriate relationships, gay or str8. We should recognize the basic humanity of gay people, and we should disgrace those who use religious hatred - that is exactly what it is no matter what they say - against gay people And in the US, the results of those who claim to convert gays to str8ness is appallng. Only about 12 % claim they are fixed. Then, over a few years, about half of them either go back to their basic nature publically, or get found out to be liars. The balance of the group goes into working in the gay to str8 industry. In other words, conversion doesn't work. What would be more interesting is to have a str8 to gay conversion group. Then we would not convert people to gayness, we would discover how many secretly gay people lead miserable lives of lying to themselves and others, including their wife or husband. We'll find out that probably 10 % of the population is really gay. And that is just fine. We love our gay friends, we are sick and tired of religious hatred being used against them, simply because religion is all about control, and these people don't want to submit to it's terrorism and demonization.

Maybe one day there will be a cure for your narowmindedness, unfortuantely it will not come soon enough.

And G-d also made narrow minded bigots like you!

Everyone here is so sure there is a god, but what if there isn't and men made all of it up? Why would a god make people suffer as people do throughout existence? Just so that they will obey him and spread light among the world? What rubbish. Freud was a remarkably intelligent man and he had it right, but I have not made him my god. He theorized that, in effect, primitive men were so afraid of nothingness that they made up rules to live by and attributed them to an unseen being that they wished would take care of them like a father. Over the years, the men called themselves rabbis and honed the rules which just happened to help civilize the world in some ways. That doesn't mean that the rules are infallible. Those rules have inspired a lot of unnecessary enmity at the same time. Regarding this dicussion - no person identifying strongly as gay has ever been changed to straight and the clergy and their followers should just accept reality. If some gays have had full intercourse with women, that does not mean that they rid themselves fo thei strong impulse driving them toward men. They may have just found pleasure in the other act temporarily. Should all gays be forced to abstain from all sex if some can achieve that? Freud says we are all potentially bisexual, but many people are on one end or the other of the continuum and it is not a conscious choice. Enough of the hatred. I'm sorry to shock you all, but it appears we will all die one day and no god will meet us after that. if one does, 99% of men will go to hell for masterbating and the other percent will go to hell for being liars. People ought to face up to reality and stop trying to change everyone who isn't like them - that goes for Jews, Moslems and every religionist who wants to change another.