Tsniut is not only about the length of skirts etc, but also about being a modest person. This Rav is not modest - how does he know that even if this woman violated one mitsva, she "makhmira" on another, like Kibud Av veEm? How dare he thinking he is closer to G-d than she is?

you say: This rabbi, if you can even call him that, is in blatant violation of both the letter and the spirit of Judaism when he discriminates against converts. RABBI SAID: THEY ARE NOT CONVERTED TO JUDAISM THE RABBI HAS TORAH and history of converts and supposed converts that is his job. He did his due deligence.... this story said, the supposed *convert failed to go to the mikvah. you are extracting words that please your argument. THE LETTER OF THE LAW IS TO PRESERVE THE NATION OF ISRAEL and in view of all these fake mass conversions and searching the world for lost jews that havent if ever been jews in 500 years and all the xtians infiltrating the JEWISH NATION to behind the scenes while posing as jews are *really missionaizing to jews to accept their idols... THE NATION OF ISRAEL MUST FORTIFY OUR NATION ACCORDING TO THE LAWS THAT MOSES BROUGHT DOWN. YOU QUESTION OF BORN Jewish woman get their identity torn from them is no where to be found on earth. NO ONE GETS THEIR IDENTITY *TORN FROM THEM, ......THEY GIVE IT UP..... Torah education will prevent this TODAYS WORLD HAS MORE FALSEHOOODS THEN TRUTH THERE ARE QUICKIE CONVRSIONS AND THERE ARE QUICKIE RABBINICAL DEGREES (SEMICHA). your compassion is nice but mis applied one law for both??? a convert cannot be a kohaine cannot marry a kohaine cannot ever visit her old family cannot go to a church with her parents for any past family functions cannot have her old past friends and more.. cannot break halacha for a specified amount of time or must answer before her bet din that converted her why she did break Torah laws. THE CONVERTED ASKED TO BE CONVERTED.. LIKE YOU ASKED FOR A DRIVERS LICENSE..THEREFORE YOU MUST ABIDE BY THE GOVERNING LAWS FOR THE ''GROUP'' YOU WILLINGLY JOINED... like the talkbacks above and i have heard many others in talkbacks THEY CONVERT ACCORDING TO ORTHODOXY THEN PROTEST ABOUT ANTIQUATED TORAH LAWS SHORTLY THEREAFTER. THE FAULT LIES MORE WITH THE, your phrase, ''so called'' rabbi that causes any ''pain '' to the 'convert' that wants to CONVERT JUDAISM AFTER STEPPING FROM THE MIKVAH. #29 take your passion to the streets of ISRAEL to stop the missionaries from romancing the jews into their dark church of sin. save the jews from the buddists and bahais and jews4jeus prancing your streets with the freedom of a rat hiding and lurking and poucning on our Torah twisting lying misinterpreting Torah... Use your compassion to assist the weak the elderly in the hospitals and care centers and the uneducated Jews....where these missionaries flood with xtian literature and con the Jews of their heritage,, family and JEWISH SOULS... in other words grow up lady.. Judaism can use your energy and wisdom in the proper places DACON9 jewswithviews@gmail.com and many other restrictions you dont

We are even wrose for allowqing the Charedi to pimp Judaism.

rabbi sharman is out of his mind. how dares he annulles convertion that were recognized by the rabbinate ? are we going to turn the stae of israel into an iranian jewish state ? are we citisens of israel going to tolarate such narrow mind on judaism ? what's next ? we already watch modesty watch groups, and what is done to protect our people from their violent behaviour ? parking lots riots ? where is the democratic law of our jewish state ? it is time the government takes action. jewish state yes ! but no antiisraeli ultra zeelot state.

You're right. The suspicion is unfair. And I know just how cruel it can be to be labeled a non-Jew when you know you are not. I have been trying to get married in Israel and am completely unable to prove my Jewish identity. I have nothing but the sworn testimony of my mother and documents that are considered worthless because they are either from conservative rabbis and shuls or chasidic ones. You are also right that it would be simpler to deny converts all together. You might have noticed most rabbis do try and discourage you from converting. But to outlaw conversion altogether would make all those with potential Jewish souls very unhappy and rightfully so. They deserve to be recognized as Jews. I think the right thing to do about this issue is keep the current conversion procedures (make them no less stringent) but not to investigate these people. I wish Rabbis wouldn't brand them this way as if telling others not to form minyans with them, marry their kids to them, etc...Converts can tell people they were converted and let these people make up their own minds as to whether they agree with the Rabbi's ruling or not. But once they brand you Jewish I think yes that label shouldn't be taken away from you. But in their eyes my opinion is worthless. Who am I to lecture someone far more knowledgeable about the Torah and Judaism? And they would be right. It is really socially unacceptable for me to offer up my opinion on the matter to them. I have never even been to yeshiva for more than a day. The important thing to remember is that they don't do this out of malice. It is just what they think is the fairest method so far. But the bigger problem is that all these Rabbis never agree and don't see eye to eye on each other's conversions. I don't see anything changing in that respect now or in the near future.

Dacon, you rage is misplaced, it also says in the article- 'annulled thousands of conversions'- we are not just talking about one woman who failed to one thing- thousands who failed to to do wahtever...? You are just as wrong to delete whatever you don't want to see.... this rabbi annulled conversions that where accepted by the Rabbinate- he overruled a higher authority- who is right? One or a group?

MY COMMUNITY TAKES RABBIS SHERMANS OPINION I LEARNED FROM TALKBACKS AND PEOPLE IN MY ROMP THROUGH LIFE TO TAKE RABBI SHERMANS OPINION IN YOUR REASONING AND LOGIC QUANTITY TAKES PRECEDENSE OVER QUALITY ,HISTORY, EXPERIENCE,INVESTIGATION AND QUEST FOR THE TORAH TRUTH, NO MATTER HOW PAINFUL IT IS FOR THE '''DECEIVED'''. ULTIMATELY TRUTH WILL PREVAIL, FOR SOME TO LATE.. SO... ACCORDING TO YOUR LOGIC,,WHY DONT THEY STAY A XTIAN ... WHICH NUMBER OVER 2 BILLION... AFTERALL,,,,,, NUMBERS ARE TRUTH ....according to your logic. LISA I CAN COUNTER YOU ALL DAY WITH LOGIC AND REASONING AND TORAH .. I DID NOT VOTE FOR OBAMA WAY BACK IN SEPT I TOLD THE PEOPLE HE WILL NOT BE GOOD FOR AMERICA OR ISRAEL....BUT THE MAJORITY VOTED FOR HIM ABARAHAM OUR FATHER WAS ALONE... I dont have the patience of Abraham to debate Ynet doesnt care more then a few days.... and i dont accept converts for the exposure of their past to a jewish people... IT TAKES 4 GENERATIONS FOR CONVERTS TO PURGE THEM SELFS FROM THEIR OLD WAY. AS I SAID, IN CLOSING..IF THEY REALLY WANT TO SERVE THE ''ONE GD OF ISRAEL',' THEY WILL ACCEPT THE RULES AS A CONVERT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES... UNLIKE COMMENTS OF #14. A CONVERT SHOULD HAVE UNCONDITIONAL LOVE FOR TORAH.. OR BE A NOAHIDE AND RELAX... BE WELL email me sometime DACON9 jewswithviews@gmail.com

I am sorry Yonatan this is happening to you. I am not Jewish- just so you know, never pretended either. I find this story very disturbing-, and it is a total surprise to me. Jews have been persecuted, decimated, almost to the point of extinction- and looking at the situation in the Middle East- 'almost' is not too far fetched an idea.... to think that rabbis or any scholar would make it so hard for people to convert- or proof their Jewishness- . If there is any truth to the anti-semitic claims written up daily- I would think any person who is willing to accept this faith and risk his life and the life of their children- he or she would be welcomed with open arms. This is not the case. One has to proof Jewish blood back to how far? The Old Testament? Sorry if this sound sarcastic- but this could be a question of survival- again. Statistically there are fewer children per family, people marrying later or not at all.... (well except for orthodox groups who have lots of children- that might change too eventually). Anyway, I hope your situation, Yonatan has a happy ending. I agree it seems unfair.

WHICH I DIDNT GO INTO BUT I WAS ON FIRE TO POST THE QUESTION IF YOU ARE A JEW.. and now you reveal you arent BUT YOU WANT TO JUDGE OUR TORAH , OUR LAWS, OUR WAYS,,, HOW MANY JEWS IN YOUR CHURCH..... I WAS BEING RESPECTFUL TO YNET ..BUT I SHOULD HAVE WENT FULL... IN ORDER FOR ALL THE JEWS TO SEE AND KNOW THE FULL PICTURE... This is a example of what i said above. > .kindness can hurt > truth will ultimatly come out This was from the hand of our ''ONE GD OF ISRAEL'' TO REVEAL SO MUCH UNSAID AND UNWRITTEN. THERE SUCH NOT BE ANY CONVERTS.. LOL BARUCH HASHEM FOR REVEALING THE WHOLE STORY AM YISRAEL CHAI LOL DACON9

1. allow (register) religious marraiges of all streams and other religions and register secular marraiges 2. Let those halachically inclined (because in a free society you can't stop them) set up geneological registries and do all the testing,investigation they wish as a precondition for the marraiges THEY will perform and recognize the popular will as expressed in peoples day to day behaviors and associations will determine who is and who is not a Jew and those who hold to a different standard are free to privately invoke their standards.

I see no reason why I should argue with you- you believe what you do- unconditionally even if it is against everything logical- this is religion. What good is it for a convert to have unconditional Love if he or she is rejected by the very people who have granted conversion in the first place? First you open your arms to welcome, then you stab in the back? Sounds pretty pagan to me, I just might take you up on your offer to write- there is the rare time I can appreciate your ideas and wisdom- your way of thinking intrigues me- sort of clinical interest you know, LOL. I wish you well too.

respectful to Ynet? Come on Dacon9- For your info: I never, ever pretended to be Jewish- I have no agenda- I just want to know- I have been reading and writing Tbs for months and months- and you just found out that I am NOT Jewish- wow... ? most TBs are polite and explain- certain people however find it necessary to be agressive and loud- because there have no logical explanation, no real answer. I do not judge you, nor the Torah, nor any other religion- if you must know. I respect religious leaders that are true leaders to their people. As for what you quote about converts: why do you pretend to accept converts then? "There such not be any converts"- couldn't be more clear- soo? why pretend and go through the motions and then reject people long AFTER they are accepted? What are you doing to the REAL Jews who stop practicing? I know many Jews do not agree with what you say- my Jewish friends are among them. as for kindness: don't over estimate yourself- I have read some pretty racy stuff from you- and it wasn't kindness.....

themselves anymore.

Hitler killed nonJews who had a distant relative or great grandfather who was Jewish or even partially Jewish. Will Israel turn away those who need Israel because they aren't Jewish enough? Is this God-like? Does this one man have the right to determine the face of Judaism?

Having seen/taught a number of conversion classes in Israel I am sorry to say that many people convert for the wrong reasons, like marriage to a Jewish partner. Hard as it may be, please understand conversion from a religious perspective. When a person converts, they take upon themselves a long list of obligations. As a religious Jew, therefore, it is hard to agree to convert a person whom you know is unlikely to lead a religious lifestyle. Conversion should be made harder/longer to weed out insincere converts. Civil marriage should be possible. Jewish marriage should be strictly observed under traditional religious law only.

finally a voice of reason. There should be a choice- actually ALL marriages should be civil- and then a religious marriage ceremony can be performed for religious people to make them happy.. This works in other countries, why not Israel? The state takes care of people's real lives, the religious groups can take care of the spiritual side and enforce whatever they want or feel necessary. Since converts do not seem to be really accepted ( 4 generations at least to 'clean' them..???????..) and the process seems to depend on the mood of the rabbi of the day, who can annul conversions from years ago because he feels there might be an infraction - the question arises: why go through all the work and heartache if there is a good chance you end up with nothing...with no reason given.? IF the religious person who is teaching conversion classes and supervises the process feels a person is not sincere- why let them go through with it in the first place? THIS is where the problem starts. What is it: the money? the prestige? Feeling sorry? None of the reasons are valid- If this is such an important step to becoming a Jew, why is there not a standard procedure- for ALL the groups to follow? Or is the problem that every group feels theirs is the only REAL conversion procedure? As long as people in Israel cannot agree on why they have their own country with all this entails- there will be many more heated discussions.

And have first half Jews , then quarter and finally no Jewish at all . Those who convert can be followers of the Jewish faith , to become a Jew they need some generations . You ask : is it the money ? This question is not very friendly , at least

so in order for a Jew to get married you need to proof you are 100% Jewish? ( I am not sure a practicing half Jew as you call it, would be necessarily worse than a Jew that does not care for his heritage etc..I see your point thought if 'clean bloodlines' are so important- however I must tell you, I remember some distasteful discussions about this in America concerning Blacks and Mulattos- ). Anyway, If you are a convert and you need several generations to become a Jew- then this does work if you want to get married- since you are at best only a follower of the Jewish faith and thus not worthy. re money: did money have to do with the anulled conversions? There was talk about thousands- this is a mass conversion to say the least.... why is this allowed? Were there shortcuts taken? Do you see where the money question comes in? With all the hurdles there could not have been that many people wanting to convert- why were they not discouraged? You see my money question is quite legitimate- has nothing to do with being friendly- sorry if you took offense..

Lisa you should have more respect for the decicions taken by the spiritual authorities of Jewish Israel. Shame on you.

...what about the religious Guerim ? Do you find it normal that our jewishness is suddenly abolished by "rabbinic leaders" who don't know us ?

A "half" Jew is 100 % Jewish if his mother is . If it is his father who is Jewish , he is NOT considered Jewish at all . I was talking about civil marriages when i said first 1/2 then 1/4 and finally no more Jewish at all . And this is , even for a secular as i am , not acceptable . It's racism ? let it be named so . For me it is preservation of our History , our people . Regarding money , you can turn around , fot me it's an UNFRIENDLY question that you asked .

respect for the spiritual authorities- yes... the question is: which one? One Rabbi annulling what another rabbi has accepted. One religious group fighting another group- and all in disagreement with the secular population of Israel, ad all the 'authorities from outside the country-

peres, ayatollah yusuf and this sherman. Retire and shut up! Enough with your senile foolishness. Let younger people take over already. Leave the converts alone,they are worth more to us than a bunch of self righteous "rabbis".

The article above mentions that the rabbi wants to proclaim the converted ladys children as "unfit" to marry other jews? What have the children done? They could not help that their mom for some reason did not go to Mikve. I think that it is awful of the rabbi to ask the woman to divorce her husband. Is it not against the law of Torah to break familys? After all, shalom bait kodem hakol!. I would like to know the husbands roll in this. Does he support his wife?

The Supreme Court is the ultimate decider of the law for Israel, and the court overruled Sherman. In fact the Rabbinic Court is just another state agency, an instrument of the Government of Israel. Rabbinic Court employees are civil servants, employees of the state of the Jews. It is the obligation of these employees, including Sherman, to at minimum obey and uphold the laws of the state which pays his salary. If the rabbi is seriously troubled, has a conflict of conscience regarding the law he is employed to enforce then, as anyone who has a conflict of conscience over the policies of his employer he should remove himself from the source of his conflict, and quit. As with any citizen of any country, Sherman cannot pick and choose which of that country’s laws he will obey. Again, if Sherman is in crisis of conscience over Israeli law or politics, as with his employment Sherman can either work for change as available under the law or, if he feels impotent also in this regard he can always vote with his feet, and emigrate. And just for the record Rav Amar, head of the National Conversion Authority has also ruled that Sherman is unfit to serve in his position. As recently appeared in the press, Rabbi Amar "issued a written order that effectively bars a controversial haredi rabbinical judge (Sherman) from adjudicating in conversion cases." So let there be no doubt that Sherman is operating outside the law, that he has no authority in matters of conversion, and that the laws of the State of Israel apply to all, anti-Zionist haredi or secular nationalist Jew.

http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3568328,00.html

thanks for this- I, and many others here have had doubts about this - some people are too closely involved to see the problems- I believe laws have to be clear, - and all have to be treated equally- basic democratic rights in civilized society- and equally important in religious communities . Shabbat Shalom-

David , you have wriiten a very long peice in support of the Secular court. Howver this is a religious matter is it not? What are the qualifications of a secular court in dealing with Halachic matters? If a Rabbinic count decides a piece of meat is not Kosher, but the High Court says it is, whom do you think the public should follow? I am trying to understand why you think this is an issue for a secular court, this seems to be a religious issue.

Just for the record, I also support Rav Amar and my commnets have nothing to do with the rights or wrongs of any particular case. It's just that I cannot get my head round as to why you think that a secular court should be the abritator on what seem sto me to be a halachic issue.