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Lieberman: Sweden acting like in WWII
Roni Sofer
Published: 20.08.09, 22:35
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31. #24 disgusted
Jacob ,   Munich,Germany   (08.21.09)
it´s true the world does not revolve around"us" jews. But the Non-Jews do as if it does! The blood libel exists only with jews,killing christians, etc. and... jews were killed for this. So Mr. or Mrs. Disgusted. we felt it in the tousands , so that´s why we are sensitive! So if like in this article there is absolutelly no proof of this accusation, it is a blood libel. This article has nothing to to with "freedom of press"
32. mohammed cartoons and sweden
Bene ,   Israel   (08.21.09)
On February 5, Swedish Minister of Foreign Affairs, Laila Freivalds stated the following in an interview:[24] We support the freedom of speech, that I think is very clear. But at the same time it is important to say that with this freedom comes a certain responsibility, and it could be objectionable to act in a way that insults people. The nationalist party Swedish Democrats (Sverigedemokraterna) started a competition to draw cartoons of Muhammed on their web site. After words of exhortation from the Swedish government, and in particular from the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Laila Freivalds, the website was shut down. When the story caught wider attention, Freivalds felt it necessesary to resign as Minister for having interfered with press freedom. (For details, see wikipedia Swedish Democrats#The Mohammed cartoon debate and Laila Freivalds)
33. This racist should his mouth for good
Chanalau, Tova ,   London, UK   (08.21.09)
.. and go back to the slime he came out of.
34. To #24
Vlady Draculovich   (08.21.09)
Why are the Jews' harshest critics almost always functionally illiterate? I swear your poor spelling and grammar so upset me that I spilled a cup of Christian blood on the floor while making matzohs. By the way "Disgusted" what is your blood type?
35. Criticism
Gustav ,   Sweden   (08.21.09)
Please stop labeling all criticism against Israel or Israelis as anti-semitism. It's getting tiresome and isn't really rational. Also, its apparent that Lieberman doesn't understand what "freedom of press" means.
36. Anti-Semitism in Sweden.
Ron B. ,   Lod   (08.21.09)
If we needed any proof that anti-Semitism is alive and well, it was provided by the cynical farce of the Durban conference sponsored by the UN. The conference gave a platform to the Holocaust denying Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. To their credit, a number of countries including Poland and Germany boycotted the conference, and more delegates walked out on Ahmadinejad’s speech. But many more delegates stayed and applauded his racist incitement. And a day after the speech, the United Nations is trying to whitewash the proceedings, suppressing legitimate protest and pretending everything is fine.. Between good and evil, Sweden is neutral. That was their stand in World War II as well. Nowadays modern anti-Semitism is blooming again as explained at : http://xrl.us/beiqsm
37. Don't worry too much.
Alex Belov ,   Moscow, Russia   (08.21.09)
There was a story in a major Iraq newspaper about Israel selling chickens in Iraq, disguised as Arab-produced, Syrian or something, poisoned with AIDS. As a proof they gave a letter from a man whose wife has contracted the disease from eating a contaminated chicken. In Russia, many major newspapers have discussed the tragic death of a few children in the city of Krasnoyarsk. Their burned bodies were discovered in a sewage collector. Some of the newspapers have claimed that the city Jews had drawn blood from the children to make matzo bread for the purpose of greeting President Putin, also a Jew, visiting the city. Please direct the Swedes to investigate these two cases as well. They must be all linked together, mustn't they?
38. #35 - Criticism and freedom of press
Doron ,   Israel   (08.21.09)
As you find criticism against Israel being labeled anti-Semitism tiring, it's equally as tiring seeing anti-Semites hiding behind criticism of Israel, i.e. criticism that singles out Israel or false criticism that demonizes Israel. Next, I don't think you understand what freedom of press means. Freedom of press means to tell the truth and not lie to to the readers, no matter what that truth is. There are actually laws against slander. As a reader of news myself, it is important to me that the news is reliable. To you truth is obviously not imortant. You just want to hear a juicy story about Israel in a negative light and whether the story is true or not comes secondary. A newspaper should be confronted when it tells big lies and breaks the trust of readers. That is equally a legal and democratic right. And why did your foreign ministry apologize for the mohammad cartoons to the Muslim community and not to Israel for this blood libel conspiracy theory? Sound like a double standard. Moreover, Aftonbladet supported the Nazis all throughout WWII. With this track record, does it surprise you that Aftonbladet is anti-Semitic.
39. #38 - Criticism and freedom of press
gustav ,   Sweden   (08.21.09)
You're caught in a loop. How can you label the critics as anti-semitic? Because the critical views is perceived (by you and others) as anti-semitic? Freedom of press means the right to publish although you may not like what is written, as long as it doesn't break any laws. Also if you've read the full article its suggestion is based on quotes from parents and different circumstances that the author links together. This is not slander, especially not by Swedish laws. That said, I think the article was poor (as the Newspaper where it was published) and that it can be questioned for its validity. As I don't view the Newspaper as reliable and of good quality, I don't read it. I didn't know of the article until this was blown up. About the Mohammad caricatures, our foreign ministry has NEVER apologized. However, the foreign ministry rejected the competition Swedish extremists held on their homepage for Mohammad caricatures. FYI, the same extremists that received the Herzl Award 2006. Aftonbladet changed owners during the fifties and hardly holds the same views as more than 60 years ago.
40. Please protest: see contact
Eriica ,   Germany   (08.21.09)
If you wish to send your protest to the newspaper or to call them in Sweeden, see the contact: Tel. 00468 725 2000 E mail nyheter@Aftonbladet.se
41. Boycotts and lawsuits won't help. Only ONE thing will work
Freethinker   (08.21.09)
An Israeli newspaper must publish an interview with someone who saw Swedish Foreign Minister Carl Bildt sodomizing a nine-year-old child. DO IT NOW!
42. #39 - I beg to differ
Doron ,   Israel   (08.21.09)
Actually it's anti-Semitism that is caught in a loop. First it was politically correct to hate the Jewish people; and then when it became politically incorrect to hate Jews, after you went too far and killed 6 million of us, you made it politically correct to hate the Jewish state. I don't know about your country, but if freedom of press collides with slander, a civil lawsuit can be pending. It has nothing to do about whether someone likes what is printed or not, it has to do with whether or not something is true or not. Opinions is a different matter. After reading the history of Prophet Muhammad and I form the opinion that he was a terrorist and I draw a cartoon with a bomb in his turban, I have not lied, but expressed an opinion. However, if you make the claim as a publisher that our military is stealing body parts from Arabs and selling them without shred of evidence, you are lying and demonizing, not merely expressing an opinion. To do that as a publisher is amateurish, unobjective and subject to lawsuit. About the Mohammad cartoons, if your foreign ministry rejected the Swedish cartoon competition, they spoke and interfered with the freedom of speech, so both you and your foreign ministry are contradicting yourselves. Aftonbladet may have changed owners, but they do have a political opinion department run by Helle Klein (sounds like a Jewish person), and she has political bias leaning to the left, or more like radical left. And the new anti-Semitism we see today is driven by the radical left. Your argument is that as long as you can get a quote from somebody who claims to be a witness, you don't need to check the sources and can print whatever you want as long as someone said it. Well, I can probably find someone mentally ill in Sweden who claims that your government is spying on him through his TV set and then publish it as the truth. You can find anybody who will say anything. If you just go by hearsay and don't check the sources and investigate, it's like you made up the story yourself, which is also true in this case. We can discuss case by case, but IMO 90% of the criticism against Israel from the radical left is propganda and anti-Semitic nonsense. I actually have lived in Sweden 3 years. I know that most of your foreign news comes from TT and they filter select what they feel is in harmony with their political beliefs from Reuters or the Associated Press et al, which in turn is released to your government tv channels and news outlets. Our press in Israel is a lot more free than yours. I just wanted you to know that since you make yourself out to care about the freedom of press.
43. #42 - I beg to differ
Gustav ,   Sweden   (08.21.09)
"[...] after you went too far and killed 6 million of us, you made it politically correct to hate the Jewish state." Exactly who are you addressing here? Me, the swedish people or everybody who isn't Semitic (Hebrews in this case)? Regarding the freedom Of press, the legal system allows you to try a case of slander in court. However, I'm certain that it would result in favor of Aftonbladet. Although I think that the publishing of the Mohammad caricatures was tasteless, ridiculous and lacked respect, I still think that freedom of press is more important. Yes, the foreign ministry interfered with the freedom of press which was debated and heavily critized by many, including the Swedish Publicists' Association. I also think that this was not the correct handling of the situation. I do not support the foreign ministry and their actions in this case. I think that the political party (and their followers) that stood behind the competition are complete morons but they shouldn't be excluded from freedom of speech/press as long as they don't break any laws. For example we have a law banning "agitation against ethnic group". Numerous neo nazists have been sentenced using this law. It's true that Helle Klein belongs to the socialist vein of politics and that she has often criticized Israels actions in the conflict with Palestina. But once again, that does not make her anti-semitic. Criticising Israel is not the same thing as denying the holocaust, saying jews are greedy by nature or similar stupidities. I agree, you can find anybody who will say (or write) anything. After that it's up the the journalist to do the first judgement. You can label the article a lot of things, but illegal? No. The article didn't come from TT and other (better) news papers didn't re-publish the story as they probably considered it to be not trustworthy. Whatever routes news take from source to publisher, it doesn't have anything to do with freedom of press. There are a lot of publishers and quality and background work differ a lot. I can't debate which country has the most freedom of press. However, I do understand that freedom of press in Israel is very well developed.
44. Sweden and Gustav
Gabor Frankl ,   Budapest, Hungary   (08.21.09)
Gustav, the only problem with your tone is the supposed apologia of radical, extremist Islam and its racist anti-Semitism. You have not one word about this, but in the meantime you slander and badmouth the Sweidh Democrats (I have a friend of them myself, who immigrated to Sweden from Argentina, NOT a native Swede, yet (!) supports them, supports Israel and the Jewish people's right to live a FREE life in abominable Sweden). I support my friend and condemn you. Your blatant double-standard is simply revolting vis-a-vis The Swedish Democrats who DEFEND Jews, while your nearly uniformly far-left political elite are maliciously and hysterically attacking Israel at every turn. ENOUGH! Enough of the double standards, enough of the innate racism in the minds of your celebrated political elite, enough of the token state-sponsored racist anti-Semitism in your country since the time of your SU and Fidel Castro-loving actively America-hater former PM Olof Palme! REPENT Antisemitic Sweden!
45. #43 - Europe as a whole played a part
Doron ,   Israel   (08.21.09)
To blame the Holocaust only on Germany is false and misleading. Adolf Hitler could surely not have succeeded in his campaign of turning the German people against the Jews without the prior history and centuries of Christian and European anti-Semitism, when Jews were a religious problem rather than a race problem. Also the Protocols of the Elders of Zion that Nazis indoctrinated the Germans with is a Russian document, not German. Sweden was no different. Swedish Jews carried passports with Jude in them and was forcefully sterilized by the order of the Swedish government. Race biology that Hitler was influenced by was also invented in Sweden. If you want to split hairs, Sweden might not have been the worst, but certainly not free of guilt. And at the same time there were Swedes who helped facilitate the rescue of Jews from Nazi persecution. I don't forget those people. And about the law, we're not talking about criminal trial, but civil trial. You have no frame of reference to make the assumption that Aftonbladet would win such a case and keep their license. It's better not to assume. Still, this has hurt Aftonbladet more than will help them gain more new readers. Today we have the internet and many more sources of more reliable news. People in general don't want pravda, they want the truth. About your discrimination laws, which are similar to Holland's, where Geert Wilders (who is not a neo nazi) was silenced for speaking the truth, you are not allowed to discriminate against an ethicity, race or religious followers. But at what point don't you have the freedom to question/critic the history of Prophet Muhammad, his ethnic cleansing of the Arabian Peninsula from every Jew, Christian and Pagan or the Caliphate that spread through violance after Muhammad's death? What makes someone anti-Semitic is not criticizing Israel per se -- we criticize ourselves all the time -- but demonzing the state, singling her out and holding her to a different standard than other states, such as not having the right to defend herself against attacks. The radical leftist movement is certainly guilty of that. Tell me which Israeli military operation Aftonbladet and other left radicals has been in favor of! I rest my case. If I had a nickel for every time I have heard a radical leftist claiming that "zionists" rule the world, are greedy, inhumane and control the media. Well that my friend is exactly what Hitler said about Jews. In this example, it is not legitimate critic against Israel or Zionism, but the same old anti-Semitism, as is the blood libel article by Aftonbladet.
46. One more thing Gustav
Doron ,   Israel   (08.21.09)
FYI, I am not Semitic, nor is anyone in the world Semitic. There has never existed a Semitic people, race or ethicity. There is only a Semitic language group. The word anti-Semitism was coined by a German ignoramus by the name of Wilhelm Marr, some intellectual snob who tried to give hatred of the "Jewish race" a clinical name. Those who has at least some education and common sense in their head, knows the "Jewish race" is a myth.
47. Lieberman is a Nut Case
Arik Silverman ,   Milwaukee USA   (08.21.09)
During and after WW II Sweden was very friendly to Jews. It accepted refugees from Denmark as a first act and gave refuge in its embassy's or by issuing passports to many Jews in other countries occupied by the Nazis. After the war it worked for peace for Israel in the Middle East, only to have the extremists in Yitzhak Yzernitsky Shamir's terrorist organization assassinate Swedish peace maker Count Folke Bernadotte. (Yes, the same Shamir who later became Israel's prime minister)
48. #44 - Gabor
Gustav ,   Sweden   (08.21.09)
So you manage to label me a racist, anti-semitic, far-left and double-standard? I can't prove anything over the internet, I'll just tell you that I consider none of this true. You say I slander the swedish democrats because I consider them morons? Are you even familiar with their politics? Please consider reading up on the views on immigrants, gay people and global culture. Start with the Wikipedia article. We're getting very off-topic here and please discuss the topic instead of labeling me attributes of the aforementioned kind. Also, since you're a hungarian you may be interested in the history and current situation for jews in Hungary. My jewish grand mother knows, she was captured, lost major parts of her family, was put in Bergen-Belsen, survived and came to Sweden where she's lived until this day. I heavily condemn anti-semitism, I just don't agree with the politics of Israel.
49. Everyone! What everybody needs to know about S, READ THIS!
Gabor Frankl ,   Budapest, Hungary   (08.21.09)
You don't DARE ever lecture me you dolt about things happening in my native country - My grandmother was deported not to Bergen Belsen, but to Auschwitz Birkenau! She herself saw the "Lian Niesnon" - "guy" in REAL (from Schindkler's List) the Führer of the camp!!! The only credible explanation of the elitist whining "I don't agree with Israel" is the simple fact that you are, imo, misinformed - what's more, brainwashed! Read this, and AFTER you have done, get back to me and talk! http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/2065 Swedening - perhaps there's GOD on Earth! Cheers, Gábor Fränkl Please YNET don't censor my response to my attacker!
50. @Doron
Gustav ,   Sweden   (08.22.09)
I'm aware of Sweden's involvement in the Ww2. We have darker chapters as you mention, and most swedes (including me) are very ashamed of these facts. However, these are not the politics of today. We've learned about jewish history (and particulary the holocaust) in school and also talks with my grand mother gave very good insights in the horrible experiences jews have had during the years. The Swedish government even freely issued a book about the holocaust to all students in 1998 called "Om detta må ni berätta". Although I do not agree to the legal surroundings of Aftonbladet I do agree that this does nothing to help them gain readers. Aftonbladet is an evening newspaper which tend to publish articles of the more sensational, gossipy, non-trustworthy kind. It doesn't enjoy the same respect as heavier newspapers such as Dagens Nyheter or Svenska Dagbladet. Geert Wilders.. I'm not familiar with him except his very strange statements regarding Islam. I also agree that anti-semitism is very much alive today. Sad, especially considering that history is documented. Sad is also the fact that islamophobia is gaining popularity. Your last paragraph is what I also consider anti-semitism. However, the Aftonbladet made suggestions against members of the Israeli military, not the jews. You don't see a difference here?
51. Acting of Sweden during WW2
Michael ALBERT ,   HOLON, Israel   (08.22.09)
Comparison of Swedish government response to recent newspaper report to Sweden's acting during WW2 is ill-informed. Deportation of Jews from Budapest was halted in July 1944,after the receipt of a strongly worded letter of protest by the regent Miklos Horthy, from king Gustav V of Sweden. The lives of tens of thousands of Budapest Jews were saved by the "Letters of Protection" issued by the Embassy of Sweden, and distributed courageously by Raoul Wallenberg.
52. Doron , 45
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (08.22.09)
Swediswh Jews carried passports with Jude , sterilised by the order of the Swedish governement . You wrote . Can you give references , i did'nt find anything as this , not in wikipedia nor in the Jewish virtual library
53. #52
NilsG ,   Helsingborg, Sweden   (08.22.09)
I think Doron may have mixed up two issues. Sweden in the 30s was intensely racist, with a delusional faith in Germanic racial superiority. As a result, "inferior" folk groups (gipsies, travelling people, sami) as well as the mentally handicapped were ruthlessly sterilized. However, I have not found any reports concerning sterilisation of Jews, nor heard any such allegations from elderly Swedish Jews who should be in a position to know. The passport issue, OTOH, appears to be true, and was not instituted at the request of Germany. HTH
54. 53 , were it not german Jews
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (08.22.09)
who had Jude in their pasports ?
55. #54
NilsG ,   Helsingborg, Sweden   (08.22.09)
Sorry, my history concerning Nazi Germany is limited (there are things you rather do not know too much about), so I may be incorrect - but I do believe you are right, that German Jews´passports were marked "Jude" but, I am fairly certain that the same happened in Sweden. The German NAzi nomenklatura made study visits to the Swedish "Institute for Racial Biology", founded in 1922. Gruesome.
56. 1
Rosie ,   Israel   (08.22.09)
"... stories of experimentation on hospital patients...." STORIES IS THE KEY WORD.
57. 4
Rosie   (08.22.09)
Thank you for your post
58. 10
Rosie   (08.22.09)
Absolutely correct. Agreee with every word.
59. 12
Rosie ,   Israel   (08.22.09)
You are so right! That Mike, whatever, should come to Israel and see with his own eyes Israeli hospitals, the number of Arab doctors, nurses, patients in each and every one of them. He should see how many PALESTINIAN children are literally SAVED in those hospitals, since they cannot get this kind of treatment in their places, because all the trillions their government gets from all over the world are spent on rockets, and nothing is left for hospitals. Why do they bring their children to Israel for treatment, in the first place? Experimentation on patients?! So why on Earth do they come here for treatment?! "Stories about experimentation on patients", stories about Christian babies' blood, etc., etc., etc. In which century are we living? Nothing has changed, but for the bleesed fact that NOW we can bite back.
60. 20
Rosie   (08.22.09)
Would you please explain?
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