And a convert can ONLY be a follower of the Jewish faith . To become Jewish , some generastions are needed .

Silly me, I always thought that the Chupa was meant to be over only the Bride and Groom. So no Chazanis. Sheva Brachot? Let the singing rabbis stand clear of the Chupa.

I banned the Rabbi using Gehtto Hebrew pronounciations at my chidrens wedding. It was a solemn yet joyfull occasion, consequently, I wanted to use the religous text as it should be spoken, not some foreign dialect.

one can't claim to be "orthodox" while including heretical (that is, your nutzarim) teachings. look it up in a dictionary what "orthodox" means if you don't believe me. and besides, no orthodox rabbi says your teachings are kosher (if i'm wrong then say who exactly). otherwise you converted under false pretenses and it is no longer valid. your proud boasts are completely empty because you can't back any of it up - and you saying so laughably doesn't count. don't get mad, just prove all of us wrong. but you can't hahaha.

How dare you attempt to equivocate a proper Jewish wedding with a shiva. How dare you! First of all, a wedding isn't about finding a reason to throw a party. It's about the union of two souls and the explosion of spirituality to new heights that results in one soul finding its mate. This isn't something that happens because of music, this is something that happens because of ritual and it happens in an atmosphere of pride, honor, and deep respect - NOT A CIRCUS! Second of all, there's no such THING as a Jewish wedding without a reception afterwards. As you well note, a wedding is a happy occasion. There is PLENTY of time for music, dance, laughter, and delicious nosh at a wedding but it must be excluded from the improper time and place - just like how we wait until after the wedding to have marital relations. I suppose you're one of those seculars who also thinks that there's nothing wrong with people having premarital sex when they truly love each other, right? Jews don't WANT goyim to be able to relate to us. We TURN AWAY potential converts three times to make sure they are pure of heart. You can take your assimilated secular ideals and keep them in Masorti or Reform "Judaism" where they belong.

I can understand how some people would object frivolity under the canopy during the actual taking of the blessings. However, I don not think there should be a rabbinical bane against such practices. I think the bride & groom should have the ability to decide if they are willing to have singing or other musical activities during the actual ceremony after all it’s their wedding.

What did they mean by "singing" . If the Rabbi sings the benedictions , is it this that they mean ? And what if there is a Chazan who assists the Rabbi , and sings the benedictions ? also not allowed ? WE are not talking about the festivities after the chouppa , only about what is happening UNTHER the chouppa . And for an ignorant , the Sheva Brachot are read AFTER the chouppa , not unther . And to 65 , NO there is NOTHING wrong to have fine relations before the wedding , or even to LIVE together before the chouppa . That's how all evoluated people who live in the 21st century act .

to#67,Charles,did you mean devaluated people?

Charles, Why do you keep insisting that multiple generations are needed for one to become Jewish? Conversion is conversion is conversion. Once converted, a convert is Jewish unless they revert to their former ways. Haven't you said before that 5 generations are needed before a convert's descendent is to be accepted as Jewish? What is the justification for that? King David was only 4 generations removed from the convert Ruth. Where does that leave him ... not Jewish?

Sounds like Tzohar is a wonderful group of rabbis and EM's suspicions are plausible. Mazal tov on your daughter's marriage.

Do you think that a convert , even a sincere one , can have the same reactions as "older" Jews ? I have worked with a true sincere convert , he even became the Gabbay of his Orthodox synagogue . I knew a woman who also converted , and married a Chassid . By both of them you could feel something "not Jewish" in their reactions to little daily life problems . And , don't forget , they don't share our history , they were not persecuted , their parents were not murdered , and so on . As i said , a TRUE convert is ONLY a follower of the Jewish faith , his/her gentile origin needs some generations to disappear . I don't talk about people in our old History , that's not a problem for me today .

What you say might be correct for the first five to ten years. However, it doesn't make sense, since I know many Jews who have far less connection to the Jewish people than most converts, and yet you still consider them Jewish. They do have grandparents that were persecuted or killed, however, all their friends are non-Jewish (except one or two), they don't know anything about Judaism or Jewish history, and they are indistinguishable from any other Canadians/Americans.

There is something you don't understand i think . I'm talking about "converts" , not assimilated Jews abroad . This piece of paper , conversion certificate , does NOT change this person's feelings , reactions . This does not give him/her the background , Jews since generations have .

No singing, no dancing, no mixing of the sexes, no fun. Wedding is holy and must sanctify god, allah, mythological creation person, whatever. Interesting that the longer these Ashknas stay in the Middle East the more Muslim, extremist Muslim even (because most Muslims like to sing and dance at weddings), instead of being a bit more chilled out like their Sephardic cousins. What's the deal with the homoerotic dancing? Is it part of the grooming process of young boys to be abused by pedo rabbis later? Ban the Rabbinate of Israel. It is divisive and extremist. Allow all streams of Judaism freedom here.

See the danger of easy conversions and not so carefull aliot?See?

Moses sang the song of songs. Didn't cheapen him. Did it? After investigating cultic practices and characteristics of cults that have many levels of authority, so much becomes clear. When you have G-d on your side, you can rejoice and sing as Moses did without fear that some false authority would be undermined. Without fear that ones control over the minds of Hebrews might slip away for who fears a man who sings terribly? Such an issue that they would strip a mans life accomplishment for singing at a joyess occassion? What an extreme step to take? What oppression of joy and what further oppression do they need that we must never see a man be a man and rejoicing? We of course as Hebrews and Judah are required under Devarim 13 to test most thuroughly authority and even after testing and finding we have a prophet, to further watch that nothing illegal is added. It is a mitzvah. So maybe we shouldn't wait till we hear something cooky or see silly singing to motivate us to step up and do the mitzvah of shedding no prophets and false additions. To think clearly on the words of G-d called real and complete Torah. Devarim 4:2 no adding to Torah. No more mind games on the Hebrews.

Sheva brachot are performed under the Chuppah as well as after the wedding meal. I would advise avoiding throwing the word ignorant around... unless you are 100% sure that you are not youself ignorant. (just ways to avoid looking like an idiot in person) Wedding days are about joy and happiness, about bringing together two people and two families in love and happiness... so sing people sing!

Yes , i was partly wrong . At all the weddings i have assisted , Sheva Brachot were said after the meal .

You are not an Hebrew,Josh.You are an absolutely nut. Your "conversion" has not transformed you in an Hebrew,but in one convert.Didn't you know that? Is this that Israel has imported? Obsessive compulsive Jerusalem Syndrome porters ,who trudge themselves around with their wheelsbarrows full of spiritual rags, muttering their repetitive stark-raving madnesses? Is that?

No you are still 100% wrong. The Sheva brachot are an important part of the Chuppah ceremony. The bride and groom will drink from the cup (under the chuppah) that the sheva brachot are made on. The second set of sheva brachot which is after the first meal after the wedding is the beggining of the 7 days of sheva brachot.

snicker... snicker.. ha... ha. hahahaha... haaaaa....haaa..ha.. (a bit of tears and rolling on the floor) ha... snicker... snicker... hooo... Then I realized this was serious. What idiocy! Insanity! The best part about this is it makes the rabbinate just that much more irrelevant and brings us that much closer to the day when this horrible chillul of an institution is shut down.

It's about those second Sheva brachot that i was talking . enjoy your icelolly , happy now ?

The Sheva Brachot unther the chouppa are seen as a part of the wedding ceremony , not a separate "ceremony" . People are NOT invited to the 7 Brachot unther the chouppa , but to those said after the meal .