Jewish Scene
Religious gays addressed in shul leaflet
Kobi Nahshoni
Published: 27.09.10, 14:43
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1. you shouldnt offend ppl who murder, eat pork, steal etc.....
Tevye ,   Chelm   (09.27.10)
What a joke! Maybe in theory only you could be a gay or dike ( love someone from the same sex ), but in practice it's clearly forbidden by Tora. What is in practice? Performing those sexual acts which make you a gay or dike. I'm sure that also not doing exactly such an act but come close to it is forbidden, because "in the heat (..) of the game" I'm sure you would forget that certain acts are prohibited! So they want to say in the pamphlet that you should ask for forgiveness from those ppl who you don't accept because they are sinners in public? For men its worse, and besides that they have also the positive commendment to procreate, but also women are wrong if they behave like this. So, if they want to sin in secret , its still wrong but up to them, but to sin in public and expecting to be accepted? Come on! Get real! I'm not saying its an illness, but sorry, some acts are just prohibited by Tora, and bad luck if you favor one of these acts. True, its the greatest urge of all, I'm sure someone who tasted once by accident porc couldnt cope without eating porc, but you CANNOT say that you are orthodox and a sinner of one of the most severe prohibitions ( in times of the Sanhedrin a capital offence ) in public. You just cannot expect to be accepted.
2. they simply want to destroy Judaism
Baruch ,   Boston, USA   (09.27.10)
HaShem didn't give us any impossible mitzvot. Sexuality can be controlled. Since the Torah forbids homosexuality, it stands to reason that one can fight this urge, if one wants to do so. The Torah forbids bestiality. Are we going to condone it if someone says he feels a strong urge to sleep with his dog but doesn't really feel confident with people?
3. religious gay
thinkagain ,   jerusalem   (09.27.10)
Gay lifestyle is the result of sexual freedom.Attraction of the forbidden fruit.Now that being gay is not anymore marginal ,they seek excitement in a forbidden gay jewish religion ,and demand the Rabbies to meet their standards.
4. gay stands for: good as you. and they are.
debra ,   usa   (09.27.10)
5. Hashem must have loved gay people because he created them
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (09.27.10)
that way. It doesn't mean that they have license to do anything they feel like, including gay marches in Jerusalem, but He brought them onto this earth for a purpose, maybe to challenge us to be kind to people who are different.
6. I am not anti gay but the "pity party" has got to stop.
lildoobird ,   Jerusalem   (09.27.10)
7. #5 should we be kind to people who cheat on their spouse?
rebecca ,   Modiin   (09.27.10)
or who beat their spouse? U know people cant help it. They're born disloyal or violent or gay. Sorry the whole Gay argument is weak - like them. If u have to be "Gay" dont throw it in my face.
8. Rebecca
Nachshon ,   Israel   (09.28.10)
Yes because people like you who make aliyah have such a strong voice. Mind your business - no one is throwing ANYTHING into your face. welcome to the 21st century
9. How can anyone comment on this?
Martin ,   Johannesburg, SA   (09.28.10)
Unfortunately, this article does not describe the contents of this pamphlet, yet everyone seems to be commenting on it. These people are gay, there is nothing that can be done about it. Judaism says that they cannot act on their sexual urges. It does not exclude a loving relationship between two men (without the acts). If this is waht they advocate, then I support them. But id they are asking to change the Torah, then I cannot agree.
10. #7 There is a wide range of behavior, some gays are
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (09.28.10)
monogamous just like straight people and some are one night stands just like husbands that cheat on their wives. There is no point in hating them because they were born with an inclination to love the same sex just as you were born to love the opposite sex. An Orthodox PHd psychologist in LA told me that he had a special back door entrance for gay men who were afraid of being seen in his office for fear people in the shul would think they were there for therapy because they were gay and would be ostracized. He said he had many gay clients who were Orthodox and not sexually active but terribly fearful someone would think they were gay and shun them. Its Hashem's job to judge them, not you or me and no I was not there for therapy but to help the therapist with a public project.
11. To 3 , Thinkagain . WRONG
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.28.10)
It has nothing to do with sexual freedom , they were BORN gay . I told it you already , but your memory .....[ or you don't want to know and accept this fact ] What has changed since some years is , that they now come out of their closet , they dare to come out publicly . Do you think that they are searching to live with difficulties ? having big problems with relatives and friends ? That they search to be rejected ? Not at all , they are born gay .
12. Bunnie # 5 & 10 . I fully agree with you
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.28.10)
13. To 11 Charles
thinkagain ,   jerusalem   (09.28.10)
Proof that they are born gay! Have gays a specific gene ,that straight don t have?
14. #11 Excuse me for not having the exact source but some years
Bunnie Meyer ,   Los Angeles, CA USA   (09.28.10)
ago the LA Times had a story about a researcher who was doing autopsies on gay men and found that in one section of the brain, there was a small but common difference in the size of that part of the brain. No that does not PROVE anything and I have seen no further research on it but I get the paper only 4 days a week for a dollar, an amount that means they lose money on my subscription as it is delivered. The Times is terribly anti-Semetic so I don't mind getting a subscription that helps them lose money.
15. To 14 Bunnie .
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.28.10)
When you Google this problem you will find many results of research or articles . I too tell sometimes things i have read , or seen , years ago , without having the exact source anymore . Here a paper costs more than 1 US$ , a weekend one three times this sum . But we have now some free papers , one of them is now # one . PS I never tought that some day i could agree with something you write .
16. 13 , Thi9nkagain . It seems that they have something
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.28.10)
different . Today's researchers say that it's something they have , not influenced so much by their environnement , and that Gays have mostly heterosexual children . That's what i have read today [ google ] We are not talking here about people who have a one day homosexual experience , but about those who have a long lasting homosexual relationship .
17. What you do in private is none of my business, but...
safta of 12 ,   Israel   (09.28.10)
when you throw it in my face, parading in Jerusalem, you are just an attention seeker..... Get medical help!
18. To16Charles
thinkagain ,   jerusalem   (09.28.10)
Names please
19. 16Charles dna gene
thinkagain ,   jerusalem   (09.28.10)
I also looked in google under gay dna.Despite many researchers looking for a gay common dna,till now nobody claimed to have found it.Here and there they find some similarities in the brain,but the scientist doubt this a proof,as the brain being flexible,it adapts itself to the needs of his owner.
20. TIME TO EXTEND YOUR HAND TO THEM
BENJAMIN ,   SINGAPORE   (09.29.10)
THEY ARE WIRED THAT WAY ! i USED TO BE ANTI-GAY, BUT NOW DAYS I UNDERSTAND THEM,ACUTUALLY THEY ARE VERY NICE PEOPLE, SO I DECIDED TO LOOK AT THE BEAUTY POSITIVE SIDE IN THEM INSTEED OF MOCKING THEM ! JEWS COMES IN A VARIATION ! GAY JEWS ARE ALSO JEWS. RELIGIOUS GAY JEWS ARE ALSO JEW. I MET MANY JEWS WHO HAVE BEEN FORCED INTO XTIANITY BY THEIR PRESURE IN LIVE.- THEY ARE JEWS ALSO ! THERE ARE ARAB JEW, TOO THOUGH THOSE THIS ONE SOUNDS LIKE AN OXYMORON TO ME ! SORRY :-) I LEARNED A LOT FROM YNET. WE LEARN EVERYTHING GOOD BOTH BAD TOO. SO IT IS EASIER TO LEARN TO CARE AND EXTEND OUR HANDS TO THESE SUFFREING RELIGIOUS GAY TOO. I GREW UP SEEING MY FATHER AND MOTHER BIENG VERY LOVELY. MY FATHER WAS A MACHO MAN, AND MY MOTHER A SEXY LADY OF THE HOUSE. SO I DIDNOT BECOME GAY AN DOF COURSE NOT- SO RELIGIOUS ( BUT TRYING TO BE A GOOD JEW EVERYDAY) i AM ALSO A NIGHTMARE :-) OK LETS BE KIND TO THOSE GAYS. RELIGIOUS GAYS OR WHOEVER GAY. SHEMINI ALZERET & SIMCHAT TORAH- MOVING IN ...REJOICE ! DONT BE SOUR GRAPS ! BEN SINGAPORE :-)
21. #5 PROVE IT!! Show me in the Tanauch, Torah, or even the
Rueben ,   Migdal, Israel   (09.29.10)
Bible. Show me chapter and verse where Hashem created gay people. Show me where it says-----"And Hashem created man and woman and blew his life into them. And this man and woman were to be one together and be a help to each other, and bear children. And Hashem saw the man and woman he created and it was very good to him. But just incase the man doesn't like the woman he created, and the woman doesn't like the man he created, let me make a same sex mate for the man and a same sex mate for the woman. And Hashem saw what he created and it was very good." Go ahead Bunnie prove it to all of us. Because if Hashem calls something an abomination one time, he means it's an abomination forever. Else how can Hashem condemn to death something that he created and approved of. You sound like an oxy moron who knows not 1 thing about Hashem or how he thinks. Stick to writing about the stupidity of your president and please don't mettle into how you think Hashem thinks. It's obvious that your puny matiated brain can't handle the bigness of Hashem and how he thinks his thoughts.
22. 21RUEBEN
thinkagain ,   jerusalem   (09.29.10)
I agree with what you say,but why this agressivity?
23. to 21 . You say it by yourself
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.29.10)
"and Hashem created man and woman ......" so he created Gays too .
24. Thinkagain . Google : "born gay"
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.29.10)
25. #23 Finish the rest of the verse--"And he told them(the man
Rueben ,   Migdal,Israel   (09.29.10)
and the woman)to multiply..... . A man cannot multiply without a womans body to conceive a child, nor can a woman multiply without the issue from a male. Read further on and you will see that Hashem is very big on the family unit with a male father, and a female mother living in marriage together to make up the family unit. It is not hard to conceive that there are those who can and will pervert what Hashem intends for us. We have a free will, but what we choose to do with that free will, will eventually run up against the judgement of Hashem, and then judgement will be doled out. First mercy, than judgement. But you are an old fool who doesn't believe in Hashem and only uses his name in a t/b when you think you can outwit him and his word, so this is really a meaningless waste of my time with you.
26. #22 I guess it's because I just get angry at people who
Rueben ,   Migdal, Israel   (09.29.10)
don't take, nor respect Hashem and his word seriously and only use his name or his word when they try to justify something that the flesh wants to do no matter what. It amuses me when the "gay" issue is brougt up, so many goyim become so spirtual. Really, all they are doing is just displaying their ignorance for all to see, and they have no idea how small and shallow they appear. Not saying they are not good people, but sometimes you can step into an arena where you are not qualified for and it will be obvious for all to see that your opponent has the upper hand.
27. To#23 and #26 (Hashem word...)
Ariel ,   São Paulo - Brazil   (09.29.10)
Laura Schlessinger is a US radio personality who dispenses advice to people who call in to her radio show. Recently, she said that as an observant Orthodox Jew, she holds that homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22 and cannot be condoned in any circumstance. The following is an open letter to Dr. Laura penned by a US resident, which was posted on the Internet. Dear Dr. Laura: Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to follow them. a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odour for the Lord (Lev. 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odour is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them? b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her? c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev. 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense. d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians? e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself? f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev. 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? g) Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here? h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.19:27. How should they die? i) I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves? j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev. 24:10-16) Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14) I do look forward to your enlightenment regarding the questions that puzzle me. Then I shall pass them along to others who may appreciate your moral leadership. Sincerely.
28. #27 Oh that's just to easy. In B'resheet 1:28-31, Hashem
Rueben ,   Migdal, Israel   (09.30.10)
let's us know that it is all about the Blessing. Stay within his commands, and you will be Blessed. Step out of what he said in those verses, and you yourself(generic statement here) choose to walk away from the Blessing. In D'Varim 30:19-20, Hashem sums up the entire reason for man. All the other stuff you wrote is just an entrapment for ridiculous reasoning of minds who cherry pick verses out of context so as to put on a display of their ingnorance. So I will not engage you in those.
29. Rueben , blessed ?
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.30.10)
With what were all those who were staying in the commands blessed when on their way to the gaz chambers ? a questioin : is using your computer on yom tov allowed ? i don't think so , but you who promotes religion do it . Hypocrisy !
30. Rueben , did god create man or not ?
Charles ,   Petach Tikva   (09.30.10)
For you he did . I have'nt to finish the sentence . he created , that's all . And when you create , "errors" can occur . Or are children who were born handicaped physically , also so becasuse their mind ? They were also "created" by your god , "errors" occur .
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