Opinion
The Arab-Muslim narrative
David Ha'ivri
Published: 10.04.12, 11:03
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61. to 55 Jerry
baha ,   jerusalem   (04.11.12)
you like to put brief sentence .i liked itbut yours did not say much it is only say less than its words . brief posts must tell more than what it is in the article to be interested
62. #53
(04.11.12)
That might have been true in 1947, although it probably wasn't, people love to throw percentages around without knowing what they are talking about, but it certainly isn't true now. My great grandchildren are third generation Israelis, it is a little hard to call them migrants from Eastern Europe, especially since I come from America, where my parents were born, and their great grandfather came from France, where his parents were born.
63. to Sarah #49
Ross ,   Jerusalem   (04.11.12)
Dear Sarah, You don't need a lot of researches just look at yourself in the mirror and you'll see the truth. Modern Israelis are not Middle Eastern and will never be. Modern Palestinians are the descendants from Interbreeding between ancient Semitics and Arab migrants from Arabia which lasted for 1400 years.
64. karyotyping
observer ,   Egypt   (04.11.12)
All that writing about DNA, karyotyping & chromosomes only proves that todays Jews are after racism. In fact those Masada skeletons who received official state burial honor were proven genetically to be Romans.
65. The Divine Narrative
Adam Neira ,   Paris, France   (04.11.12)
G-d has his own story in mind for Jerusalem, The Holy Land, Middle East and Planet Earth. As I mentioned to David Ha'ivri on his visit to the Beth Weizmann Centre in Melbourne in 2010, the correct model and vision for the Holy Land must be adhered to if peace is to unfold. It has been prophesied that all people will turn to the one G-d over time. This is a process. Prophecy is immutable. BTW, I like all the following names for the 150,000 sq.m. trapezoid platform in the midst of the Old City... The Temple Mount, Noble Sanctuary, House for All Nations, Centre of Unfolding Potential.
66. Just 1 question to observer
YZ   (04.11.12)
When will you stop your anti-Israel and anti-Jewish hate and activism?
67. To: No. 63
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (04.11.12)
My late father was positive for the Cohen gene. He was blond and blue-eyed. I'm blond and blue-eyed, but I am still a bat Cohen. King David was a red-head with blue eyes. My husband, a sixth-generation Israeli on one side and a fifth-generation Israeli on the other, has dark eyes and dark hair and is olive-complexioned. My children are (I think) a stunning combination of both our coloring. I know many Jews whose parents and grandparents came from Poland and they have dark hair and beautiful brown eyes. Just what exactly is a Jew supposed to look like? It isn't what we LOOK like, it is how we think, a shared set of values and a common purpose. The hallmark of Jews, everywhere, is that the overwhelming majority refused to intermarry (cattle breed, darling; people intermarry). The occasional rape -- there were lots of those -- cannot be helped, but that is scarcely our fault. It's our unique way of thinking, our extraordinary intellect, the value we put on education, among other things, that makes us different. What's physical appearance got to do with it? I am Jewish, and I trace my roots back to the people who followed Abraham when he made his covenant with G-d, who were in slavery in Egypt, who were at Mt. Sinai with Moses, who suffered in the Babylonian captivity before being restored to our home, and who suffered enormously during 2,000 years in exile. Now we are home. You, on the other hand, are free to stare in the mirror as long as you like. If all you see is physical appearance, you're probably not much of a Jew to begin with -- assuming you even ARE a Jew. So go ahead and intermarry -- or, in your case, interbreed -- with whomever you like.
68. To: No. 64
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (04.11.12)
No, the genetic history and the recovered DNA tell a very different story, but just as soon as I stop laughing at your ridiculous post, I will invite you to provide proof to your absurd claim. Never heard of a Roman yet who inscribed religious texts in ancient Hebrew! You are SUCH a fool -- how do you even stand yourself? But what you may wish to launch yourself upon is a study of how very, VERY different genetically the ancient Egyptians are from present-day Egyptians. Modern Egyptians aren't even REMOTELY descended from ancient Egyptians. See, the wonderful thing about mummifying is that it preserved everything, including DNA. That of the ancient Egyptians does not come remotely close to the DNA of modern Egyptians (I use the term "modern" quite loosely -- nothing modern about you lot). You do, on the other hand, share strong genetic qualities with people from the Arabian peninsula, people from the Sudan and people from Chad. In Alexandria, there are some (lighter-skinned) Egyptians who share certain DNA characteristics with people from the Greek islands. Looks like your claim to history and a grand past is just a bunch of hooey. Why am I not surprised?
69. To: No. 53
Sarah B ,   U.S.A. / Israel   (04.11.12)
They are Jews, though, aren't they? That gives them all the right to be in the State of Israel that exists. Arabs and Moslems, on the other hand, spend more time squabbling and fighting one another than they do anything else. You need only look at the Arab so-called "spring" to figure that out. JEWS come from the Middle East. That's all that matters. We co-identify on the basis of religion. Stop trying to use your silly distinctions upon us; we are (thank G-d) nothing like you.
70. Baha: your appalling English>
HaifaGuy   (04.11.12)
>is a symptom. Why don't you express your chaotic thoughts in Arabic and I'll get by on Google TranslateTool? Enough about the form, now let's get to the substance of your erratic post. Wait... There IS none! But let me try anyway: Culture we can't understand? Which culture? The one which teaches you that Jews are a crossover of pigs and spiders? Or the one that teaches you to value death over life and take pride in it? Or is it the the culture that has turned you into UN/US/EU welfare bums living in squalid shanty towns amid backwardness, ignorance and medieval violence? Or is it the one that teaches your men to fear, emprison and demean women wrapping them up like mummies (the Egypt connection?) and depriving them of any femininity, dignity and self-esteem? Or is it the culture that justifies and encourages the most hideous, ridiculous and irrational lies as long as they serve any Islamic issue at hand, such as false historical and religious claims (see "Moses took Palestinians out of Egypt")? Did I miss anything? Let me know if I did, in good and clear Arabic, please. Here's a good example of how piling up lies upon lies eventually ends you up in an embarassing position: You said it yourself: "...it is not related to ecovomic statue or the religion or the languade..." (original Eng) You, Arabs, are not related to anything in the ME except the Arabian Peninsula. So why don't you grab your things, your family and your evil lies and move back into the Arabian desert where you truly belong? Have a fresh start? Face your demons? They are within you, you know, not outside. And get a huge mirror and make a habit of looking into it daily, asking yourself each time: "Have I changed for better today or am I still the same lazy, evil, violent and infantile loser I always was?" Knowing your ilk, you won't do any of the above, so Happy Passover to us and a big, warm "Eat Your Heart Out" to you, zalami.
71. #24 taylor
solomon ,   bklyn   (04.11.12)
It would help discussion if you would Read Some History and not rely on wishful thinking. Let me give you a hint: all your posts are silly as they contain fantasies as well as wishful thinking. You should include yourself in the author’s description of the ‘Muslim Arab mindset and culture’ (fourth paragraph).
72. #63 Ross
solomon ,   bklyn   (04.11.12)
Most Israeli Jews are from arab countries or their descendants, having been kicked out in 1948. The Museum of the Diaspora had a slide show of faces of Jews; one saw how different we are. I do know how you can ascribe a certain look to Jews; prejudice [a nice word for hatred]. If however you describe being Middle Eastern as distorting history, honor killings, hatred between groups to the point of killing each other (eg sunni and shia), you are actually talking about being Muslim. First we heard the argument that “Pals” are a distinct people who have been there “since time immemorial”. That didn’t work, so you fall back on them being interbred from semitics and “arabs from arabia”; arabs which came during the Moslem conquest of 636AD, thousands of years after the Jews. And they themselves insisted they were not “Palestinians”...until they self-invented themselves as such in the 1960’s. And we are supposed to take your posts seriously?
73. #53, #54 lydia
solomon ,   bklyn   (04.11.12)
Most Israeli Jews are from arab countries or their descendants, having been kicked out in 1948. The Romans named the area Palaestina (after the Philistines who were Greek) to try and get rid of the Jewish connection to the land. They didn't try to get rid of the arab connection as there were NO arabs. Read some history about the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah, more than a thousand years before the birth of Muhammed. Don't post your wishful thinking; it's too obvious you don't know what you're talking about.
74. to 70
baha ,   jerusalem   (04.11.12)
iam not zalameh iam a woman and a grandmother iam happy here in my house iam not angry from your post . becouse you are wrong about my gender and about evry word in your post at least about my personality . yes iam not good in english but sure very well in arabic i can write poemes .. thank you to give me some time from your valuable one
75. #60 baha (#61, #74)
solomon ,   bklyn   (04.11.12)
I am happy you are able to post. Welcome. I understand when you say "it is related to the land". I do understand regarding Egyptians. I also hope you understand regarding Jews, in that it is ALSO related to the land -- it is the culture which you shoud understand as in that way it is like your own. Salaam. Shalom. Peace.
76. #47, #64 “observer”
solomon ,   bklyn   (04.11.12)
#47- First you state that there were no Jews there, now you admit to a Jewish ‘colony’. After the Romans destroyed Jerusalem the Jews populated all of the Galilee. No arabs back then as the Romans named the area Palaestina (after the Philistines who were Greek) to try and get rid of the Jewish connection to the land. They didn't try to get rid of the arab connection as there were no arabs. The arabs came from arabia (get it?) with the moslem conquest. Related to the disappeared Canaanites? May as well say they are related to the Neanderthals. #64- You continually post how the Jews of yore "are not related" to the Jews of today, and how the "Pals" are "related" to the Canaanites...then you accuse others of racism?! At least keep your lies consistent. You have already demonstrated that YOU are the racist. BTW: as for roman skeletons in masada, it is not proven they were or were not jewish. it is believed by 77% that they were jewish through carbon-14 tests that were carried out on the fabric. (See Jerusalem Post, Sept 20, 1991 as well as the Addendum, "Human Skeletal Remains from the Northern (sic) Cave at Masada—A Second Look" by Joseph Zias, Dror Segal, and Israel Carmi, Masada: Final Reports, Vol. IV, pp. 366-367.) And you have the chutzpah to accuse those who commited suicide of being cowards? Your nom de plume is a joke.
77. fantasy
Mounadil ,   Egypt   (04.13.12)
How can someone be as dumb as David Ha’ivri?
78. This conversation was a great help to me...
Zionist   (04.15.12)
> “This conversation was a great help to me in understanding the Muslim Arab mindset and culture. Facts are not really so important to them. They can be made up or even changed as needed. Understand that we are dealing with people who celebrate being detached from reality as part of their worship of Allah” Lol, the kippah must be tighten way too tight on this bigot’s head, smashing whatever little brain God has given him to begin with, or else why would he be spewing the same nonsense that has been spewed towards his people for Millenia?? — Wow indeed! Yeah, all we Muslims really need is that a Jewish bigot “analyzes” our “mindset”. But just for the record, did anyone tell this delusional bigot not to use on others the same type of Super-crappy/craaaazy/hatefilled psychoanalysis that has been use on him by his enemies for the past, oooh I don’t know! thousands of years? and which also “proven” to the bigoted enemies that his people’s “mindsets” were also “deficient”?? — But I guess after all a bigoted “mindset” like his is same everywhere, no matter which community they’re from bigots are same everywhere, and it doesn’t matter if a bigot has been victim of bigotry him/herself, they have the same “mindsets” in hating, so how’s that for crappy-psychoanalysis Mr Ha’ivri??. But seriously, is’t wrong of me that I want to snatch-off his head the beautiful symbol of Judaism that he should at least not be wearing while spewing hatred towards others? for in doing-so he’s only mocking the fine teaching of Judaism that I’m sure promotes respecting other’s traditions, cultures and beliefs. And trust me I feel the same way if I see a Muslim spewing bigotry while wearing Islamic symbols too. > “It is unrealistic, in my opinion, to believe that we can turn the Arabs into a society that truly embraces western concepts and values” What’s truly funny is how this bigot is promoting the Supremacy of foreign “concepts and values” to others. — But 1st)- Before he promotes them to others, if he’s sooo in love admiring said “western concepts and values”, then why isn’t he trying to promote their supremacy to his extremist-Zionist buddies that are so steeped in human right violations of murdering, imprisoning, creating systems of open-air prisons, Apartheid and ethnic-cleanings? — And 2nd)- Why would Middle-Eastern Arabs and Muslims “embrace” “western concepts and values”? when they have their own that are not that different?. — 3rd)- Maybe it’s time for this bigot to look into his own Jewish “concepts and values” that forbids bigotry towards others, and when he realizes that the Jewish concepts and values are not that different than the “western” ones he’s admiring so much, or the Islamic ones for that matter, then he can truly preached them to his extremist-buddies that has forgotten them, and by extension maybe he can finally realize that Muslims/Arabs as well have those same concepts and values, and not in need of “western version” of them.
79. Arab not Muslim
Dannykid ,   Australia   (04.25.12)
In a recent interview on 60 minutes, a Christian Palestinian Arab, a Lutheran Minister, stated: ”The only thing that Palestine was able to export successfully was Christianity” and “Christianity has on its back a stamp saying ‘Made in Palestine’ “. So maybe this is an Arab talent not just a Muslim one.
80. Mindset
Mohammad ,   Amman Jordan   (07.07.12)
Hello, Muslims believes that all prophets David, Solomon, Jacob, Abraham, Muses, Jesus and Many others some are mentioned and some are not, they are all coming with the same message from one god, god of all humanity and creatures, prophets had the same faith and spread the same believes against their people, each prophet was sent toward a particular nation, Most of prophets were sent to sons of israel(Jacob), followers of prophets Believes in one God, Muslims also believes in one god, that is why Muslims says prophets were Muslims.
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