Jewish Scene
Rabbi, bereaved parents clash over women's singing
Goel Beno
Published: 04.05.14, 15:18
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27 Talkbacks for this article
1. Find his place - not as rabbi or Safed
Brian Cohen ,   Judean Peoples Front   (05.04.14)
If he can't find his place in Israeli society in which women and men serve and die and women and men together honor the dead - then he should quit and go work elsewhere. I live in a relgious community where men and women will be on the stage talking, singing and respecting this nation and all its citizens. Like I said...if he can't do the job and represent everybody with respect and dignity, he should quit and move to live with the intolerant dossim abroad.
2. Women singing and dancing at the memorial
Chaim ,   Israel   (05.04.14)
are shaming the fallen soldiers. These women should perform in a secular city like Tel Aviv not in a holy city like Safed.
3. Feminism vs. Jewish traditions
Jhan   (05.04.14)
Jewish traditions represent life, feminism is death on a grand scale.
4. Idiot.
Dan   (05.04.14)
5. I simply wish that on a day like this the
Al   (05.04.14)
Rabbis would simply shut the hell up. No one asked them for their god damn opinion. Let us who have lost our loved ones thanks to war and terrorism mourn our loss without having to listen to your chicken shit.
6. ANOTHER "I'M MORE JEWISH THAN THOU" RABBI mutters "STOOPIDS"
Dav Zee ,   America is beautiful   (05.04.14)
opinion: stand up to the "I'm more Jewish than you" bullies and perps. Another completely SIMPLE MINDED PRONOUNCEMENT BY "MR. HOLIER THAN THOU" yapping his 8th century shallow myopic superstitious NONSENSE...that "JEWISH women especially, are husband owned chattel" WOMEN ATTENTION: IF YOU WANT TO SING >>>SING OUT LOUD, OFTEN AND HAPPILY! You are allowed by STATE LAW- It's called living in a freedom of religion for ALL that includes Democracy... IF YOU WANT TO PRAY>>>PRAYER AWAY! IF some religious leftover's MORONIC attempt to curtain your human rights in a religiously FREE DEMOCRACY (supposedly the only one in the middle east) fight back, SING YOUR HEART'S OUT and if he and his his welfare army DARES to try and stop you...sue'em for religious persecution, disallow their positions of any authority, stand up to them, fight them in the Kinneset, stand up to them, fight them in the streets, stand up to them, fight them in the schuls, fight them in the schools, fight them in the real world (80% secular Israel), stand up to them, defeat them, put them in their place! Keep them the blazes out of defeating women's DEMOCRATIC rights...
7. Let them sing,but don't get offended
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (05.04.14)
when some men will walk out or close their ears.
8. There Are Many Religious Fallen Soldiers
Yishai Kohen ,   YeShA, Israel   (05.04.14)
And their families don't want to be subjected to transgressing and hearing women sing. By forcing it, the army is discriminating against the religious and not making the ceremony open to all.
9. THE RABBI
David ,   HERZLIA ,ISRAEL   (05.04.14)
i kindly suggest to the rabbi, WALK OUR AGAIN FROM THE CEREMONY, OR BETTER STILL DON'T COME AT ALL. !!!!! WHAT A CHUZTPA HE HAS !!!!
10. If it bothers her so much, why is she talking about it?
Ephraim ,   Tapuah   (05.04.14)
11. Why are seculars continuing to coerce religious Jews
(05.04.14)
into anti-Torah stuff? Why can't the secular be tolerant for a change? Why do only haredim have to be tolerant of the lawless G-dless secular?
12.  9 Less chutzpa than you!
(05.04.14)
13. From the halachic view point the Rabbi is right
S Judah ,   Jerusalem   (05.04.14)
Those who are outraged by his comments show no respect to our religious laws and obviously know no better, why in these circumstances when you are not a religious expert do you believe you have the right to question the Rabbi! If you parked illegally and got a fine, thats seculaer law and you cannot challange that even if you don't like it. Better you acknowledge what he says may be religiously right, but say that you not being observant don't have any problem with women singing. Your problem is that you demand respect for a secular view point but don't give it for a religious view point. Secular hypocricy I say!
14. its a personal choice.
Lemmings Hotline ,   sd usa   (05.04.14)
He didn't tell them to stop, did he?
15. #11
Ralph ,   Rishon   (05.04.14)
No-one is forcing the Rabbi to go, so how can you say that they are coercing him.
16. Please explain about women and singing
Daniel ,   Tel Aviv   (05.04.14)
I don't pretend to be a biblical scholar or even all that religious, but if memory serves, women always sang in the bible. Miriam Devorah, other women for Kings David and Solomon and so on all sang. Why now are Rabbis opposed to singing women? It seems rather counter to Judaism. Suddenly some Rabbis are pulling all the joy out of Judaism to conform to their morbid ideology (and frankly to me they sound more like crazy right wing Christians than any Jew I ever knew). To me the loss of song and music performed by anyone male or female is the loss of a blessing Hashem gave to the world to enjoy.
17. Disgusting
Taxpayer ,   Hod Hasharon   (05.04.14)
On the day when all of the Jewish citizens of the State of Israel, at least all of those who have any sense of self-respect - unite with the memory of the fallen men and women who have died so that we can have this wonderful country - how sad and disgusting it is that we can be subjected to the disgusting arguments we see here. Anybody whose children have not served or who has not served themselves have zero moral case to dictate to the rest of us. Soon, as the ultra-orthodox succeed in splitting our people in two - into those who follow the Jewish religion and those who follow the ultra orthodox offshoot, we will lose our unity as a people, and as in ancoent times we will end up splitting our country as well. How sad and how tragic
18. #11:Because God is a very risky/highly phoney proposal and
tom ,   tel aviv   (05.05.14)
while perfectly allowed in a pluralistic society, it is the last thing that should even be considered as a norm for entire society. On a personal level anyone is welcome to gorge his/her eyes if their God commands them to. Peddlers of superstition, even as sophisticated as Judaism (and it IS sophisticated in so many ways!) should keep their quiet on divisive issues, that have no practical bearing on their cult's daily routine.
19. than how he explains Miriam - the older
lili   (05.05.14)
sister of Moses - dancing in public, even in the bible women were allowed to dance and sing in public, it is tradition. as for this idiot of a rabbi, he doesn't follow the bible otherwise he would have known simple facts.
20. Women singing
A Feiner ,   London UK   (05.05.14)
to No.19 in the Torah it says that Miriam went off with the women to sing. this is how the halachs is arrived at. Rabbis are not stupid, check your facts first in future please
21. Derech Eretz
Sherlock Holmes ,   London England   (05.05.14)
Perhaps the Rabbi can attend the first and main part of the memorial gathering, followed by a brief pause for those who may prefer to leave at that point, and then a second part with women singing etc. There is probably no Orthodox synagogue in the world that would have women singers at a memorial service. Just in passing, the Baltimore Hebrew Congregation had a mixed choir at a memorial service for Abraham Lincoln, as a result of which a group of members left and started Chizuk Emunah as an uncompromising [no mixed choir] synagogue. London's magnificent Hampstead Synagogue at one time had a mixed choir, but evetually accepted you can't be Orthodox and also have a mixed choir. The mixed choir went.
22. Complete segregation of Haredim..
Seth ,   Massachusetts, USA   (05.05.14)
... is the answer. They're non-participants in the national life anyway with their chumras-du-jour, virulent anti-Zionism and intolerance of others' views. The place for them is in a shtetl somewhere - preferably far away. Birobidzan comes to mind or somepace equally remote.
23. NEVER FORGET! 50% of rabbis are below average
Dav Zee ,   America is beautiful   (05.05.14)
50% of these rabbis are below average: in intelligence, belief in human rights, social responsibility and it's perceptions, tolerance, and way above average in believing in their heart felt Jewish bigotry, in believing in discrimination, and are corrupted and use the state as a free ride without any commitment to support the state that protects them and their whacko ideas of being anti-women and follow their man made beliefs, superstitious rituals of nonsensical ideals and ideas. To say nothing of their rampant nepotism and sexual misdeeds onto innocent children. zee
24. #16:Seems that our "frumme" men, just like their Muslim
tom ,   tel aviv   (05.05.14)
counterparts, live under a very real and present danger stemming from their inability to control the sexual urge (that the secular, "unclean" society managed to do quite well, thank you). As result, they have to erase/cover every possible reminder of the "other", in this case: the females of human species. Pathetic & sad & ridiculous and galling! But their womenfolk seem to dig it, so what the hell....? On the positive note: the childish Catholics have taken this unnatural behaviour into stratosphere by banning sexuality from the realm of 'pure" relation with God. Oh boy, if it weren't true, nobody would believe it could've been done. I wonder: how the hell did we discover wheel?!
25. 21 Sherlock,that's what happen..
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (05.06.14)
in my birth country in Europe.Rabbis attend modern marriages and quit BEFORE mixed gender dancing begins
26. 24 tom therefore Haredim manage ..
observer   (05.06.14)
quite well without sex shops.
27. 23 Dav,never forget that stereotypes
ORA ,   JERUSALEM   (05.06.14)
show a low level mind.
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